the problem with "just lowering everyone's damage"

Ruin Lance·2/27/2018, 8:18:40 PM·41 votes·3,028 views

everything relating to healing or shielding becomes incredibly broken and anyone with aftershock just becomes invincible for a certain amount of time.

item 3190 item 3107 Janna Lulu Soraka etc

Like good luck trying to kill anyone at all.

I'm not proposing anything but the suggestions some people are coming up with are really not that well thought-out and the solution isn't as obvious as people think it is. A lot of work would need to be done to basically everything in the game along with runes and I wouldn't expect much until S9 or MAYBE mid-season.

101 Comments

ChargeItDownMid2/27/2018, 8:20:54 PM53 votes

[deleted]

AMYS GRAVE2/27/2018, 9:44:15 PM16 votes

Congrats, you discovered the consequences of powercreep. Doesn't mean we can't lower both....

WiegrafOfValor2/28/2018, 4:26:20 AM7 votes

Because when you do a massive change you never tweak anything else, right?

Of course Healing and Shielding would be reduced together with damage output. It's so obvious that no one even bother to spell it out everytime they ask for damage to be lowered.

xelaker2/28/2018, 3:30:37 AM6 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ruin Lance,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0npW2EMw,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-02-27T20:18:40.974+0000)

everything relating to healing or shielding becomes incredibly broken and anyone with aftershock just becomes invincible for a certain amount of time.

item 3190 item 3107 Janna Lulu Soraka etc

Like good luck trying to kill anyone at all.

I'm not proposing anything but the suggestions some people are coming up with are really not that well thought-out and the solution isn't as obvious as people think it is. A lot of work would need to be done to basically everything in the game along with runes and I wouldn't expect much until S9 or MAYBE mid-season.

the funny thing is they keep upping damage to be able to out perform shields and heals, then they buff shields and heals to keep up with the burst

IT3etlWEXJ2/27/2018, 10:45:54 PM6 votes

The game is fine as it is right now tbh. These people crying about "too much damage" are really overstating the problem

Rıots Bad Client2/27/2018, 11:46:17 PM4 votes

NERF EVERYTHING!!!

(Or just nerf every item.)

deadlychuck2/28/2018, 1:25:45 AM4 votes

Why wouldn't "Just equally lowering everyone's healing/shielding" not be a simple and adequate solution to this proposed problem?

Andrey03452/28/2018, 7:54:58 AM4 votes

Then... lower heals and shields too, by the same amount?

ChuShoe2/28/2018, 12:38:12 AM4 votes

The only reason they have such high shielding and healing capability right now is because damage is so high, if it wasn't, they'd be actual trash.

Simple solution, nerf damage, and nerf healing and shielding. There's no reason for either to be high right now.

ChaddyFantome2/28/2018, 4:20:27 PM3 votes

Obviously we,d adjust those too. They are only in this state as a response to the damage creep.

The Lexer2/28/2018, 3:02:10 AM3 votes

I would like to add that a lot of tanks (Sejuani Sion etc.) are currently in the meta right now. Imagine how these guys and others (Maokai Galio Zac etc.) would fare if they were taking even less damage

General Esdeath 2/28/2018, 4:20:09 AM3 votes

Then we just lower the numbers on healing, we can do this one step at a time.

Done252/27/2018, 10:54:15 PM2 votes

I'm fine with increasing HP by like 20% just so that fights don't end in a flash. It's absolutely bonkers how quickly someone can be deleted these days. Even tanks melt hard.

floo2/28/2018, 8:31:04 AM2 votes

Riot took a long time to invent more and more damage in the first place..

Poske2/28/2018, 8:54:10 AM2 votes

While people have bad suggestions. The way you think outcome ll end up is also bad

Kaeblen2/28/2018, 3:14:11 AM2 votes

That would be why people proposed the NURF gamemode a while back.

Either people love it, or they DONT. regardless of the result, people now see the problems for what they are, rather than just theorizing blindly. ######I am, btw, one of those who supports the "lower all damage" idea. Even so, the sheer number of changes necessary is staggering.

TeCoolMage2/28/2018, 10:26:29 AM1 votes

But rito is rong all dmg buffs r bad wtf too much dmg everything has 2 b a dmg nurf or els rito no balans

When it comes to damage I agree with the sentiment but I can't take the boards seriously because of the reasons above plus the fact they believe:

  • Base damages have been relatively the same
  • Runes/itemization changes bring damage too high
  • Boards thinks it's reasonable to nerf base damage, scaling, and everything that isn't runes/itemization which caused the problem. Also, any increase in damage (whether they're a meta champion or not) is inherently bad now. Less damage is less damage, right guyz?!
Spoofghoul2/28/2018, 1:21:16 PM1 votes

Well one way to decrease damage

is by not decreasing it but scaling up tankiness where needed, that could be done large scale by changing the way how the formula for armor/mr works

But also by increasing/decreasing base stats where needed

The other option is tampering with penetration and other stats like crit making it more situational like tying in bonus armorpen with crit and moving it away from the last whisper items then reducing crit damage foring more desison making between crit, flatpen or AD or added utility or defense

That's just an example of splitting up universally overpowered damage into be strong vs one target but weaker vs another with your damage or gaining power elsewhere vs having pure damage

The same could be done with magic damage make voidstaff gain more utility stats over AP for example and force a choice between having power vs all targets to having power vs defensive builds gain massive power vs tanks but gain barely anything vs squishier targets

There are lot's of ways to go about dealing with damage being too high but imho the best way would be to move away from damage builds being generally effective and force decision making.

right now i mostly see this in tanks, you can be effective vs dealing with basic attack damage through getting reductions from randuins and tabi for example but then you have to use 2 slots these items do a lot less vs ability damage or raw high AD attacks and are completely useless vs magic damage and of very little use vs true damage they also are vulnerable to penetration to a degree. You gain effectiveness vs 1 type of offense but you sacrifice slots making you not so effective vs all other ways people can deal with you you want maximum protections then you have to sacrifice things like cdr or certain actives or other utility

I think we need to go the same route for damage as well