Kassadin movespeed nerfed by 5??

MisterIceman ··22 votes·11,246 views

He has a 53.03% winrate, his biggest problem is his ultimate, especially at level 16, and you decide to nerf him by taking away his movement speed by a measly 5?! You've got to be kidding me. I don't know if this is official yet, but this is what it's been saying on every website. Seriously how does this balance him in any way?

59 Comments

The entire team7 votes

Remember what happened with Irelia when she got her -5 movement speed

WoonStruck10 votes

Yeah, basically nothing.

What hit her hardest was literally losing parts of her kit, not -5 MS.

2gudaiya2 votes

{quoted}

Yeah, basically nothing.

What hit her hardest was literally losing parts of her kit, not -5 MS.

wrong, go read the patch notes.

3TWarrior3 votes

actually, all it did was make the people who committed bad ganks perform worse. If the person knew how to play her and when to make plays, it had next to zero impact on her performance because she relies primarily on abilities

it had a win rate impact on average, but that was because it made the worst players perform worse

to put 5ms into perspective. it takes 20 seconds for you to lose 1 teemo of distance... the smallest unit of impactful distance

in 20 minutes, you've only lost 12 teemos of distance, maximum

movement speed has barely been relevant for years because half of the items out there have slows or movement speed passives

it "was" an important stat because previously, it meant the difference between catching someone and being outrun...they've redone everything since then and almost every champion comes equipped with a dash or some means of excess in their kit

2gudaiya1 votes

{quoted}

actually, all it did was make the people who committed bad ganks perform worse. If the person knew how to play her and when to make plays, it had next to zero impact on her performance because she relies primarily on abilities

it had a win rate impact on average, but that was because it made the worst players perform worse

to put 5ms into perspective. it takes 20 seconds for you to lose 1 teemo of distance... the smallest unit of impactful distance

in 20 minutes, you've only lost 12 teemos of distance, maximum

movement speed has barely been relevant for years because half of the items out there have slows or movement speed passives

it "was" an important stat because previously, it meant the difference between catching someone and being outrun...they've redone everything since then and almost every champion comes equipped with a dash or some means of excess in their kit

a nerf is not supposed to make mains perform worse at the champion, it exists to force casuals off of champions that are supposed to be gated by some or another skill disparity.

me as the season 2 irelia player I haven't given a shit about any of the irelia changes, as someone who has just picked up the champion for some freelo due to being overstatted the ms nerf hurts. I was already looking to play irelia as her final iteration will play out, super mobile jumping to all the minions not wasting any movement and orb walking to the maximum while weaving in E and W casts. that level of execution was not required when she had the extra ms one could just walk on people and stick on them regardless. likewise the extra dmg on her passive wasn't needed pre-ms nerfs because there was no burden of execution on the pilot, all actions could be directed at champions solely instead of having to dash to minions to grab sustain and drop agro.

this is a much more layered game than you guys think lol. her disarm got removed because it was too impactful in teamfights seeing as it's still gonna disarm when she's dead, but that isn't helping her to execute in those fights like the larger slow on her ult because she has to dash to multiple targets, just like in lane.

add to that she was proving to be problematic in mid, so how do you fix that without removing the champion from the map? you nerf the ms, skillshots are now easier to hit on her unless she is executing absolutely correctly by dashing in and out of fights, but that requires foresight which she didn't require with the 5ms still on her.

but I digress, you don't care about this stuff, you just want your problem champion nerfed as though you losing to them makes them strong. that champion has been gifted so much power to bridge her ms gap, rito handled it well by making her passive stack to 5 no doubt, but the kit in all does more for her personally than it does for her allies, as opposed to the fresh rework doing plenty for allies and less for her personally when it came time for large skirmishes.

her E got nerfed cause people weren't aware enough at any elo to account for it being cast twice, so they made her have to wait longer to punish people, which is fine means resources are handled better in lane, that cd nerf stops mattering post items though. so yeah. welcome to league. the ms matters derp but only to the uninitiated, as intended.

3TWarrior1 votes

a nerf is not limited to one set of people. If a champion is insanely hard to play but has a 100% win rate in the hands of a master, is that not warranting a nerf? Irelia was too good all around. Now people are sketchy about trusting Irelia because her average win rate is low, yet she still has very high to absurd win rates in the hands of her best players

That's where the problem came from. Her damage and versatility were too much. Movement speed may have limited her weaker players, but it did absolutely nothing to the average or greater players because they knew how to engage in the first place

this is where the meme "Riot nerfs everything but the cause of the problem until there is nothing left to nerf" came from. They always do something random like this and act like it affects gameplay and not just winrates

Her disarm was removed because she had too much versatility, able to use 2 effective forms of hard crowd control on her targets while having the mobility of an assassin and the durability and item set of a bruiser

Garen is adopted3 votes

[{quoted}](name=The entire team,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0ZzMBuE6,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2020-01-05T08:24:02.933+0000)

Remember what happened with Irelia when she got her -5 movement speed

nothing?

14daysuspensionk1 votes

[{quoted}](name=The entire team,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0ZzMBuE6,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2020-01-05T08:24:02.933+0000)

Remember what happened with Irelia when she got her -5 movement speed

An Irelia had fucking 40 kills in my last game lmao.

ZephyrDrake6 votes

I remember when cait got a -5 MS nerf a long time ago and it actually made her a much more balanced champion. I also remember how Graves was broken and just a measly -3 base AD brought him to more respectable lvls of power. People constantly underestimate what these "small" changes do to champions. Then again if it's not "X champion loses half it's ratio or has double CD on Y" it apparently never does and won't affect the champion in question in the slightest... despite the many, many samples that say otherwise

KyojiTakajo2 votes

To be fair, Graves' change is lot more impactful due to him being primarily a jungler. Losing base AD on JG is insanely more damaging than -5 MS on a champ that essentially has flash up at any time. The change will obviously affect him, but I feel like its impact is a bit overstated on a champion such as Kass.

hhaavviikk1 votes

{quoted}

I remember when cait got a -5 MS nerf a long time ago and it actually made her a much more balanced champion. I also remember how Graves was broken and just a measly -3 base AD brought him to more respectable lvls of power. People constantly underestimate what these "small" changes do to champions. Then again if it's not "X champion loses half it's ratio or has double CD on Y" it apparently never does and won't affect the champion in question in the slightest... despite the many, many samples that say otherwise

It's also perceived nerfs that help, a long time ago riot put in a nerf for caitlyn, her winrate dropped, then riot revealed oopsie they forgot to atually ship the nerf, even if you don't nerf a champion and just say that you do winrate drops, winrate doesn't mean anything.

NF Remilia5 votes

His early game goes even more down?

MisterIceman 12 votes

{quoted}

His early game goes even more down?

How is -5 movement speed going to affect him though? Yes, technically, its a nerf, but that barely even tickles him.

NF Remilia5 votes

Below diamond yes , people wont see a difference on their games. In challenger however when people know how to counter roam him and everything 5 speed effects him a lot. V1per once won the game because his opponent missed 3 cs .. And v1per snowballed out of that.

0 Hogapu11 votes

just to make it clear :

Kassadin loses 5 ms over 340 ms total

all this means is that after 68 seconds of movement, he will be 1 second worth of movement behind compared to before nerfs

--> this does in no way affect roaming potential.

Last time Riot did this, it was for Irelia , whose game play is based on kiting melees through auto attacks that outrange most of them. In this case, the nerf somehow made sense.

In Kassadin's case tho, it hughly doubt it will do anything.

Thefrostyviking11 votes

[{quoted}](name=0 Hogapu,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0ZzMBuE6,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2020-01-05T14:32:44.255+0000)

just to make it clear :

Kassadin loses 5 ms over 340 ms total

all this means is that after 68 seconds of movement, he will be 1 second worth of movement behind compared to before nerfs

--> this does in no way affect roaming potential.

Last time Riot did this, it was for Irelia , whose game play is based on kiting melees through auto attacks that outrange most of them. In this case, the nerf somehow made sense.

In Kassadin's case tho, it hughly doubt it will do anything.

In Irelia´s case that nerf did literally aboslutely jack shit.

Which is why the very next patch, they did the following :

Cooldown increased to 20 / 18 / 16 / 14 / 12 seconds from 16 / 15 / 14 / 13 >/ 12. Base damage reduction reduced to 40% from 50%. REMOVED: No longer grants 1 additional stack of Ionian Fervor Ionian Fervor.

This is huge, losing the easy passive stacking off her W alone hurt.

But was it enough? No she was still strong.

So 3 patches later this happened :

R : Wall duration reduced to 2.5 seconds at all ranks from 2.5 / 3 / 3.5. REMOVED: No longer Disarm icon disarms for 1.5 seconds enemies passing >through the wall. Slow increased to 90% from 60%. Base wall damage increased to 125 / 200 / 275 from 75 / 125 / 175. Undocumented: Wall's VFX no longer changes depending on whether Irelia's >passive is fully stacked or not.

Lost the disarm, huge deal for melee matchups and dealing with escaping marksmen.

Q : REMOVED: No longer deals double damage to minions. NEW EFFECT: Deals 45 / 60 / 75 / 90 / 105 bonus damage to minions.

Less damage on minions means it´s harder to stack passive = more vulnerable due to her being increasingly reliant on it as other things get nerfed.

REMOVED: At 4 stacks, Passive no longer deals 200% bonus damage to shields.

All this enough? No.

So she got nerfed on an additional 4 occassions, one massive and then 3 medium and smaller ones.

Only then was she settled.

So was the -5 movespeed a joke? It definitely was and not a funny one either so the chance of Kassadin magically becoming more balanced off it is so small i would not bet even a cent on it.

0 Hogapu2 votes

I had the vague idea in my head that it actually solved something somehow for Irelia's case. But yeah anyway, if nothing happened with her, then less than nothing can ever happen to Kass I guess.

2gudaiya9 votes

[{quoted}](name=MisterIceman ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0ZzMBuE6,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2020-01-05T08:15:31.520+0000)

How is -5 movement speed going to affect him though? Yes, technically, its a nerf, but that barely even tickles him.

if you do this then you don't know how this game works. 5 move speed is a serious nerf

FSRER3 votes

{quoted}

if you do this then you don't know how this game works. 5 move speed is a serious nerf

On a champion who relies on walking yes. A -5 speed on Hecarim would indeed be a huge nerf but it is not on a champion that all his engages and disengages rely on a blink, not at all.

2gudaiya1 votes

{quoted}

On a champion who relies on walking yes. A -5 speed on Hecarim would indeed be a huge nerf but it is not on a champion that all his engages and disengages rely on a blink, not at all.

he gets molested in lane now by the jumpy assassins that everyone loves to write rage posts about. watch this space, tell me what happens.

FSRER2 votes

{quoted}

he gets molested in lane now by the jumpy assassins that everyone loves to write rage posts about. watch this space, tell me what happens.

But Kassadins entire point of exsistence is to be a anti mage pick that loses to assassins! It is not a valid arguement to say that it is a nerf since he loses to assassins which he always did anyways!

2gudaiya2 votes

{quoted}

But Kassadins entire point of exsistence is to be a anti mage pick that loses to assassins! It is not a valid arguement to say that it is a nerf since he loses to assassins which he always did anyways!

the mages can land their skillshots on him easier with -5 ms. so yeah, good nerf by rito.

FSRER5 votes

{quoted}

the mages can land their skillshots on him easier with -5 ms. so yeah, good nerf by rito.

It is a -5 speed nerf, he can still get boots at lvl 1 and just wait it out till lvl 6 where he will dash all over the place and to a main Kassadin, as long as his resistances or damage are left untouched, means nothing

2gudaiya2 votes

{quoted}

It is a -5 speed nerf, he can still get boots at lvl 1 and just wait it out till lvl 6 where he will dash all over the place and to a main Kassadin, as long as his resistances or damage are left untouched, means nothing

it's all relative, if he's buying boots lvl 1 he's gonna fall short on either dmg or mana sustain. wow have you just pointed out actual choices kass players will now have to make? see, it's a nerf. accept it now and stop being...whatever you're being that I can't say outloud on the boards.

FSRER3 votes

{quoted}

it's all relative, if he's buying boots lvl 1 he's gonna fall short on either dmg or mana sustain. wow have you just pointed out actual choices kass players will now have to make? see, it's a nerf. accept it now and stop being...whatever you're being that I can't say outloud on the boards.

A nerf that will be ineffective and missed the entire point of why Kassadin is overpowered, this was my point from the very beggining. And honestly, when at your every post you get -5 downvoted and at another threads you go all "yeah downvote facts kids! I am tired of this" I am not the one who is being a nuisance, you are.

ZephyrDrake2 votes

{quoted}

A nerf that will be ineffective and missed the entire point of why Kassadin is overpowered, this was my point from the very beggining. And honestly, when at your every post you get -5 downvoted and at another threads you go all "yeah downvote facts kids! I am tired of this" I am not the one who is being a nuisance, you are.

sorry but no, it is not ineffective and it did not miss the point of why he is OP. He is meant to be a late game champion. Nerfing his damage would just make it so that people don't pick him since why would you bother picking a late game champion that has no late game? You are severely underestimating impactful a MS nerf is. Kass doesn't start the game with a maxed out ult. His early game will be easier to punish, he will have to be even more reliant on his ult to move around and his ult sucks until lvl 11 and even then it just becomes ok. Kass's ult doesn't become truly strong until lvl 16.

You making the early game weaker means it will take them longer to reach their late game status, it would make them be more easily punishable up until the point where they are meant to be strong. If riot is doing a nerf like this it literally says one thing. They are more than fine with how strong his late game is but they are not fine with how easy/safe his early game is so they targeted that part that they feel should be more easily punishable and guess what? a MS nerf does that perfectly.

ZephyrDrake3 votes

{quoted}

On a champion who relies on walking yes. A -5 speed on Hecarim would indeed be a huge nerf but it is not on a champion that all his engages and disengages rely on a blink, not at all.

it makes his early game worst, it makes him even more reliant on his R and that thing until at least lvl 11 isn't all that great. It allows you to catch up to him easier up until he is able to spam his R. It literally is a nerf that will make him a much riskier pick in general. "it's not a huge nerf" yeah, I heard that one so many times for similar nerfs and most of them actually do a pretty good job at making the champion more manageable.

Crescent Dusk1 votes

{quoted}

On a champion who relies on walking yes. A -5 speed on Hecarim would indeed be a huge nerf but it is not on a champion that all his engages and disengages rely on a blink, not at all.

That doesn't happen until lv6, what the hell are you doing until then if not abuse him and zone him off CS and xp?

Zero Skill Tank1 votes

MS nerfs are something you definitely feel early in the game. 5 MS doesn't sound like much, but it makes you be easier to hit by skillshots, and basic attacks while CS-ing.

What they are trying to do is to make his early game more abusible without afecting his lategame too much (because lategame he just flashes all over the place anyway).

That being said, I don't think it's enough.

UpDownLeftRightAB1 votes

[{quoted}](name=MisterIceman ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0ZzMBuE6,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2020-01-05T08:15:31.520+0000)

How is -5 movement speed going to affect him though? Yes, technically, its a nerf, but that barely even tickles him.

That's what it is, it's so they can say they nerfed him while literally doing nothing at all. Fuck em, they are literally just bullshitting at their job. Game is just a way to creatively troll as many people as possible now.

Daddy Ants1 votes

[{quoted}](name=MisterIceman ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0ZzMBuE6,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2020-01-05T08:15:31.520+0000)

How is -5 movement speed going to affect him though? Yes, technically, its a nerf, but that barely even tickles him.

Actually quite a lot until super late game when he has rank 2/3 ultimate.

Sewer Side4 votes

Riot and Kass players want Kass to be strong at 16/late game

Considering his laning is average, his roaming is eh, and doesn’t start rolling til 11+, nerfing his early game more will significantly do more than reducing his late game power.

5 ms does matter, especially since Riftwalk can be punished early game. Move speed nerfs are 2nd most significant, aside from range nerfs.

floo2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sewer Side,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0ZzMBuE6,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2020-01-05T13:01:06.912+0000)

Riot and Kass players want Kass to be strong at 16/late game

Considering his laning is average, his roaming is eh, and doesn’t start rolling til 11+, nerfing his early game more will significantly do more than reducing his late game power.

5 ms does matter, especially since Riftwalk can be punished early game. Move speed nerfs are 2nd most significant, aside from range nerfs.

5 ms can matter if it's about a chase and escape scenario, which kass don't bother in the slightest past 6. Even less so than Irelia, and even that one was already laughable. It's literally nothing.

Dotty LB1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sewer Side,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0ZzMBuE6,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2020-01-05T13:01:06.912+0000)

Riot and Kass players want Kass to be strong at 16/late game

Considering his laning is average, his roaming is eh, and doesn’t start rolling til 11+, nerfing his early game more will significantly do more than reducing his late game power.

5 ms does matter, especially since Riftwalk can be punished early game. Move speed nerfs are 2nd most significant, aside from range nerfs.

Its if they want him at that power at 16m, its the same with kayle for the most part. This issue is that even with all that considered he is overtuned. Cant eally ignore a 53% WR, same with Fizz. The -5 ms is not going to do anything.

oOPhrozenOo1 votes

Then maybe riot shouldnt have permabuffed his early game the last 2 years. He's at a point where he just beats everyone early, can easily trade into melee assassins like zed early on and beat them-

I see many kassa mains going electrocute with ignite into mage matchups. He has just been overbuffed to a point where he has an absurd winrate. An unhealthy champion like kassadin should never have a winrate above 49% winrate, why? He is supposed to be the anti mage e.g. a counterpick in specific scenarios but he is more than that even against lanebully mages like syndra he does very well actually and syndra will be oom before she can seriously push him out of lane and after 6 u just jump on her anyways and trade her. Then he is supposed to be the hardest scaling assassins meaning the hypercarry assassin which many of us know what that means. So riot really needs to wrap their heads around what they actually want from kassadin. To be the anti mage and beat mages in lane? Fine but then he can't scale as ridiculous as he does OR he is the lategame hypercarry assassin fine but then he can't be so good early many player actually go VERY aggressive in their build on him to win early and become unstoppable from there on.

-5MS is a placebo nerf nothing else. Riot loves kassadin for some reason. Every year now he got buffed and buffed multiple times. Always small buffs ofc because riot is cautious about buffing him but same as ekko they now managed to break him.

Sire Hippington3 votes

Main reason his winrate went up this preseason is the manascaleing on his ult. It went from ~51% to ~53% in 9.23, and the big change that directly affected Kassadin was that presence of mind now gives max mana instead of refunding a small % of ult CD(which on a high CD ult is nice, but on kassa it's hardly noticeable) the 500 extra mana on kassadin result in 15AP from Seraphs and 10-30 damage on the ult(based on stacks) For a full rotation with fully stacked ult, that's 78 aditional damage once Seraphs is completed, paired with a bigger manapool to keep the ults going. from a minor rune that also restores 20% mana on takedown to help his ult spam in teamfights. That's more than twice as much damage than Scorch does at lvl 18, on less CD, and that's just a sideeffect of it while scorch is nothing but that damage.

Also, the power of lategame dragons/elder also goes in his favour, by the time dragonsoul or elder become a thing, he's fully stacked up and from there on it becomes rather easy for team kassadin to controll dragons.

That said, 5 base ms is a nerf, even on kassadin since his ult doesn't really kick in till lvl 11. It's not gonna gut him, but he will feel it. However, i hate ms nerfs, they feel alot worse for the mains than they actually are for the powerlevel, it's a feel bad nerf with not to much(thoguh still some) actuall impact. Imo they should have adjusted some base damage and mostly the manaratio on the ult instead.

Ragnaveil2 votes

Funny how champs with mana ratios on spells are the trouble children currently. Makes you wonder.

Crescent Dusk3 votes

[{quoted}](name=MisterIceman ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0ZzMBuE6,comment-id=,timestamp=2020-01-05T07:40:43.277+0000)

He has a 53.03% winrate, his biggest problem is his ultimate, especially at level 16, and you decide to nerf him by taking away his movement speed by a measly 5?! You've got to be kidding me. I don't know if this is official yet, but this is what it's been saying on every website. Seriously how does this balance him in any way?

The movement speed is meant to nerf his early game. It makes him more abusable since he'll be less able to dodge harass, and if assassins all-in him he'll have a much harder time disengaging before he dies.

I don't think you understand how much of a liability Kassadin is early to his team.

I as a jungle absolutely despise having a Kassadin mid because I know the enemy mid will be roaming 24/7 and invading my jungle while my Kassadin sits by his turret through most of the early game. The first dragon, we will lose.

If the enemy picks an AD assassin, the Kassadin is even useless up till 16+. That's virtually most of the game and the vast majority of games get decided way before then.

Kassadin is like Vladimir, both of them cost you early and mid game, set you way behind as a jungle and then you pray they are actually good and can carry after having been of zero impact for your team as your team 3v5's because the enemy jungler is ahead and your jungler can't do anything since those scaling champs offer zero lane priority for river scuttles and dragons/heralds.

Hedge Witch1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Crescent Dusk,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0ZzMBuE6,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2020-01-05T15:12:11.103+0000)

The movement speed is meant to nerf his early game. It makes him more abusable since he'll be less able to dodge harass, and if assassins all-in him he'll have a much harder time disengaging before he dies.

I don't think you understand how much of a liability Kassadin is early to his team.

I as a jungle absolutely despise having a Kassadin mid because I know the enemy mid will be roaming 24/7 and invading my jungle while my Kassadin sits by his turret through most of the early game. The first dragon, we will lose.

If the enemy picks an AD assassin, the Kassadin is even useless up till 16+. That's virtually most of the game and the vast majority of games get decided way before then.

Kassadin is like Vladimir, both of them cost you early and mid game, set you way behind as a jungle and then you pray they are actually good and can carry after having been of zero impact for your team as your team 3v5's because the enemy jungler is ahead and your jungler can't do anything since those scaling champs offer zero lane priority for river scuttles and dragons/heralds.

This - the only people whining about kassadin are the ones that don't play and understand he is useless lane phase.

nm10103 votes

It is a win rate nerf. It doesn't really solve any of his problems, but it will lower his win rate 1-2%.

PaffWasTaken2 votes

Riot's balance team is just feeding the meme at this point

ProphetOfDraven2 votes

[{quoted}](name=MisterIceman ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0ZzMBuE6,comment-id=,timestamp=2020-01-05T07:40:43.277+0000)

He has a 53.03% winrate, his biggest problem is his ultimate, especially at level 16, and you decide to nerf him by taking away his movement speed by a measly 5?! You've got to be kidding me. I don't know if this is official yet, but this is what it's been saying on every website. Seriously how does this balance him in any way?

It's a decent nerf. He will now be easier to chase and harder for him to clean up fights, roams will be harder and every time he walks up to CS he is more vulnerable to poke even if its just a bit.

Zeyphel2 votes

Kassadin has 52.4% WinRate, so what? Ahri has been like that every single patch and no one complained.

At least you can easily counter Kassadin with AD matchups.

The main reason for Kassadin to be this strong is because he counters some of the strongest champions in the meta: Fizz 52.3% WinRate Ekko 52.6% WinRate Ahri 51.9% WinRate and others.

In this patch there are a lot of mages who are strong and whenever mages are strong Kassadin is going to be strong. I am okay with Kassadin receiving nerfs but don't complain about the nerfs when there are other champions with higher WinRate and Riot is not even touching them. Ekko Mordekaiser Fizz

Galiö2 votes

The MS nerf hurts his early Hurts his lichbane if he is rolling Hurts his precision rune (forgot the name for now) edit: fleet footwork

It's a decent nerf. Is it a gigantic nerf? Not really but it's pretty good.

Also people making it to 16 is a recent thing in the meta so itll take time to adjust.

Illidan is HOT1 votes

He should get his mana costs increased IMO. This champion was designed and balanced around time when there wasn't item 3003 giving him 25% lower mana costs or Presence of Mind giving him free mana. I feel like he should be gated by his mana costs a bit more. His ult was supposed to cost 800 mana when on max stacks but Archangel reduces it to 600. That's A LOT especially when he gets free mana from Presence of Mind and his W got buffed in the past. If they raised his max stacks ult mana cost to 1000 from 800, it would still be reduced to 750 by Archangel which means it would still be less than originally intended cost of 800 mana. Kassadin builds Archangel 99% of the time so that should not be a problem.

EATARI1 votes

I don’t think you recognize how important movement speed is. This nerf means it takes him another 2 seconds to gank either sidelane from mid. It means it takes another 3 seconds getting back to lane. It means that he relies on his ultimate more for mobility and will die to more pre-6 ganks and will be more likely to die when OOM. It may not sound like much now, but it will make a difference.

Infernape2 votes

{quoted}

I don’t think you recognize how important movement speed is. This nerf means it takes him another 2 seconds to gank either sidelane from mid. It means it takes another 3 seconds getting back to lane. It means that he relies on his ultimate more for mobility and will die to more pre-6 ganks and will be more likely to die when OOM. It may not sound like much now, but it will make a difference.

Not to mention, Kassadin gets forced out of lane by everything that deals physical damage because he's the squishiest champ in the game in terms of base armour and armour growth (aside from Ori without her ball and Thresh with no stacks of his passive). If that happens, it's going to take him hell of a long time to get back to lane pre 6. It would cause him to lose a lot of CS thinking about it.

Ragnaveil1 votes

They nerfed his physical resistance because of his unnessisary bonkers late game. Maybe if it wasn't this bad he wouldnt have had to get nerfed in general. That and if Riot could just let anti-mage champs just be anti-mage, not just somehow spec into being anti-everything on top of it.

14daysuspensionk1 votes

Yeah and Vayne AP scaling nerfed by 5.

Usernamehere12351 votes

While I think that Kassadin is indeed deserving of more strategic nerfs, I think you underestimate how massive a movement speed nerf is, even when it seems like a small value.

In the mid lane, losing movement speed in general is really bad for any champion, because they lose extraordinarily valuable seconds when roaming to help jungle or gank lanes. Not only that, but this generally reduces his mobility in between dashes, making it easier to collapse on him if you have the burst.

Nerfing Kassadin's movement speed by 5 would be akin to taking 8 AD off of Darius lvl 1. It may not seem like a huge value in and of itself, but a difference like that is game changing for a champion.

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