Calling all Champ Concept'ers, share your experience!

Sir ArmaMalum·7/8/2014, 3:44:01 PM·7 votes·900 views

So I'm going to be making my next [Guide] on creating a Champion Concept, I've been lurking in Fan Creations long enough to say I've got a comfortable grasp on it as well as making a few entries myself for good measure. But naturally I'm only one person and my way is only one of a hundred (if not thousands) ways to go about it, so I invite you all to share what you know and how you do what you do.

Of course, I'm not going to ask you for a step by step from each of you, that's a lot of time and might be something you'll want to keep your own (understandably). So I'm just going to ask you a few questions, feel free to answer as many as you like and even add your own if you want!

What's the most difficult part of creating a champion in your opinion?
What's the easiest?
When designing the kit, how do you get a baseline for the numbers?
Do you feel including base stats is necessary?
How long do you normally spend on a champion concept? If varying, what's the longest you've spent?
Do you approach a champion as a character or a game element?
What's your favorite champion concept on the CB right now that isn't your own?
How do you like to format your concepts? (i.e. Lore, then kit, then jokes, etc.)
Thinking back to your first concept, what do you wish you knew then that you know now?

Thanks in advance guys and gals, and keep up the awesome work!!

20 Comments

Elphrihaim7/9/2014, 7:13:41 AM4 votes

Have you seen Katsuni's Guide?

My own opinions will be so radically different that they are not applicable; I make a concept by first already having a character and then trying to constrain what they can do / should be able to do into 5 abilities. That said:

Difficult part

Choosing how the kit should interact with itself.

Easy

Writing the first ability or two.

Design #s

Instinct.

Base Stats

yes, but general approximations are fine ('high base, low scaling', for example, instead of '500 + 60' health)

Time Spent

10 hours (Khelsa) to 8 months (Wirym).

Character or Game Element?

Depends, sometimes I make them because I need to think of abilities that they would have, sometimes I make them because I want to make a certain ability (Khelsa's Q was something I just had to make; Wirym HAD to have a charm, dash, and PBAoE DoT)

Favorite CB Concept that isn't yours

I can't remember the CB concepts at this moment, I may reply to or edit this post later.

Formatting

'What is most important to this character?' I like to do Image -> Lore -> Stats -> Kit -> Quotes -> Gameplay -> Build.

First Concept

I can't find my first concepts. The earliest one I can find is 'ok' to me, besides the #s being totally bogus. It has utility and damage appropriate for the role; besides the ult.

So.. I guess what I wish I knew then was how to work with #s, how to give somebody utility to do damage instead of damage that has utility.

Hoffmisc7/8/2014, 4:19:19 PM3 votes

I guess i'll have a try...

What's the most difficult part of creating a champion in your opinion?

The lore and/or passive. I usually start making a kit and then I get to the passive and I just stop and think "WHAT THE HELL AM I SUPPOSED TO PUT HERE"...
And I've only ever done lore on one champion...

What's the easiest?

Nothing. I'm bad at this :D

When designing the kit, how do you get a baseline for the numbers?

I don't normally do numbers but when i do I look at in game abilities that are similar to what I'm making.

Do you feel including base stats is necessary?

I do and I don't? I like seeing base stats and I feel bad whenever I post a champion without them but they're kinda hard to figure out and truly appreciate when its on (metaphorical) paper.

How long do you normally spend on a champion concept? If varying, what's the longest you've spent?

When I start a champion I try to get it finished as soon as possible, and then there are the ones I never finish...
I'd say two weeks tops?

Do you approach a champion as a character or a game element?

Both? I always call a champion by their name but I usually remember them more for their gameplay.

What's your favorite champion concept on the CB right now that isn't your own?

Toaster, without a doubt.

How do you like to format your concepts? (i.e. Lore, then kit, then jokes, etc.)

Lore
Base Stats
Kit
Quotes/Extras

Thinking back to your first concept, what do you wish you knew then that you know now?

Take your time and make sure that you are truly happy with the final product. Don't let the criticism of others dictate how YOUR champion should be, but taking helpful advice is certainly fine.

Also given that this disscusion is meant for people who make champions or are intrested in making them i'm going to take this time todirect you to the Champion Compendium (Community Beta Edition), if you want your champion in the compendium post a link on the main page and I will look at it as soon as possible. Thanks for your time.

The Neverworld7/8/2014, 5:09:18 PM2 votes

What's the most difficult part of creating a champion in your opinion?

The background/origin of that Champion. It has to be unique and yet so complicated. Like Yasuo. Yasuo is the first Samurai in the League, yet he's using a wind technique. This isn't just a theme taken, but also a unique concept on paper.

> What's the easiest?

I would say the abilities can be sometimes really easy if you know how to do. Sometimes it can be hard to synergize the abilities with each other.

When designing the kit, how do you get a baseline for the numbers?

Think of what the main ability of your Champion is. Let's take Skarner - He E's to slow, he W's to shield and he spams his Q to deal continuously damage - Skarner's main ability is Q, everything is centered on this one ability.
The rest is easy, the main ability gets the most damage scaling while the others have more like low to medium numbers.

> Do you feel including base stats is necessary?

Yes and no. Sometimes when you want to create a complicated or high-risk high-reward Champion, sometimes it's better to do the base stats in order to show what weakness he has - if he's tanky, squishy, slow, fast, can sustain through lane phase ecetera.

> How long do you normally spend on a champion concept? If varying, what's the longest you've spent?

The longest? One week.
I always try to make everything clear and come to the best conclusion for the Champion, this can take some while. Sometimes I'm that much inspired that I can post a new Champion within some hours, but only if I got a unique kit in my mind.

> Do you approach a champion as a character or a game element?

As a Champion Designer, though Custom Champion Designer, you have to see both aspects. The character itself is what makes the game element come to live, but can't work if the game element does not fit the character.

What's your favorite champion concept on the CB right now that isn't your own?

Can't say, I like some few concepts, but only because it's unique.

How do you like to format your concepts? (i.e. Lore, then kit, then jokes, etc.)

Reminder(Link to prologue or thread where previously mentioned/revealed bit by bit) ; Lore ; Appearance ; Trivia/Explanation ; Stats ; Kit ; Explanation/Walkthrough ; Quotes ; Possible Skins ;

> Thinking back to your first concept, what do you wish you knew then that you know now?

That you can't create a Samurai with two skill sets that are pretty overpowered.

Any advice for new champion concept makers?

Do it if you like it. Riot won't take your concept and probably won't even read it - So don't bring up high hopes and enjoy the Champion that becomes alive in your mind.

CaptainWednesday7/8/2014, 7:46:14 PM2 votes

I've made around 5 or 6 concepts, so I think I can help out here!

What's the most difficult part of creating a champion in your opinion?

Honestly, lore/backstory and theme are the hardest things to decide on. Designing skills and calculating numbers is fairly easy. However, creating an entire storyline for a character is very difficult. You have to decide where they fall in the timeline, how they relate to other champions, avoiding conformity/blandness (making them unique), giving them personality, and ultimately deciding if they fit in the League of Legends at all.

What's the easiest?

I'd say creating the champion's skills. Just watching television, other video games, reading, observing art, and imagining things can typically yield a great number of skill ideas for a champion. Little known fact, the inspiration for Riven's Q (Broken Wings) came from a move performed by Marth in Super Smash Bros.

When designing the kit, how do you get a baseline for the numbers?

Usually, I look toward similar champions. First, I start with champions with the same class or secondary class. Then, I look for similar playstyles like if they are burst, poke, or sustain oriented. Finally, I grab three champions and decide from there where my concept's power base should fall in comparison.

Do you feel including base stats is necessary?

While it may not be necessary, I enjoy posting and seeing concepts with base stats. Providing base stats help see where your champion lines in the game as they scale from LVL 1-18. A lot of people mess this part up as well. I've seen some champion with starting AP that scales with level, around 800 starting HP that scales around 100 per level, and ones with 310 starting MS. Some silly stuff.

How long do you normally spend on a champion concept? If varying, what's the longest you've spent?

I'd say for entire lore story, kit, numbers, quotes/lines, miscellaneous notes, and skin ideas I'd say about a couple weeks. The longest I have ever taken on a full concept was about two months.

Do you approach a champion as a character or a game element?

I always, always, always approach the champion concept as a character and never as a game element. You should breath life and personality into your champion concept. It should never become just an element. After all, champion creations do not conform to meta, they form meta.

What's your favorite champion concept on the CB right now that isn't your own?

Hmm... I cannot exactly remember off the top of my head. Summoners, The Neverworld and Rubitonbuilding (I hope I got that right) both have some great concepts out there. They often impress me with their ideas.

How do you like to format your concepts? (i.e. Lore, then kit, then jokes, etc.)

For the most part, I start with an introduction, into inspiration, appearance, backstory/lore, stats, kit, quotes/lines, skin ideas, then notes and whatnots. It feels like it flows well.

Thinking back to your first concept, what do you wish you knew then that you know now?

My very concept would be Rix'Khan, Lord of the Void. He was a hybrid fighter. I suppose I wish I had known had the difference between TOTAL AD and BONUS AD because... oh boy. Well, the concept was broken in power.

Anyway, that's that. Thanks for the inquiry Sir ArmaMalum!

Remlap12237/8/2014, 8:08:38 PM2 votes

What's the most difficult part of creating a champion in your opinion?

For me, it's balancing. It's hard to make a champion with a unique concept and have a kit that fits the theme, while still being balanced. My newest champion I'm creating right now is a hybrid damage portal mage that has lots of hard CC and the ability to blink, but can't do them at the same time. Despite him being rather squishy, I'm fairly certain the community will consider him very OP because of how powerful his abilities are, despite the fact that silence will basically cancel all of his abilities.

What's the easiest?

The lore for me. I look what League hasn't done yet in terms of what would draw someone to the League, and roll with it. I'm a pretty good writer IMO.

When designing the kit, how do you get a baseline for the numbers?

Mostly off of what the other champions have in numbers for their niche. Obviously it can't be the same, so I tweak it a little bit, but I also play it by ear on what people say.

Do you feel including base stats is necessary?

I like to give a baseline so that people don't automatically call my champions OP. It is one more thing that people can critique on so I can improve, so for me it's necessary.

How long do you normally spend on a champion concept? If varying, what's the longest you've spent?

Depends on how everything fits. Sometimes I can hit a snag in abilities and it will shelf indefinitely, like a musician champion I came up with that amplified auras with his passive. Other times it just falls so neatly into place that I can churn it out in less than a day (Polaris was an example of this for me).

Do you approach a champion as a character or a game element?

Since I'm much better with lore than numbers, I view them as a character.

What's your favorite champion concept on the CB right now that isn't your own?

There was a shaman support champion that placed totems or something on the forums a while back, but the name escapes me.

How do you like to format your concepts? (i.e. Lore, then kit, then jokes, etc.)

Name
Summary
Strengths
Weaknesses
Base stats
Abilities
Lore
Quotes

An example of how I format my champion concepts here... (Shameless self promotion FTW.)

Thinking back to your first concept, what do you wish you knew then that you know now?

Read your stuff out loud. From abilities possibly being overpowered to grammar in the lore, reading aloud almost completely summoner 11 s that problem.

Flintfall7/8/2014, 4:40:35 PM2 votes

I'll be glad to answer some questions!

What's the most difficult part of creating a champion in your opinion?

For me, making a champion is equally difficult in all aspects, lore, kit, design, personality. I can't say I haven't struggled on any of those, but there are times where it just comes to me.

What's the easiest?

Personality and lore are easily my favorite parts of making a champion!

When designing the kit, how do you get a baseline for the numbers?

Ok, this question is a bit more complicated. For numbers, I like to start with similar abilities that already exist in League. From there, I determine their place in the kit, whether or not I should shift power into that ability, and then adjust later as I see fit. Really, there is no surefire to determine if your numbers are correct unless there is testing, so I just go with my gut mostly.

Do you feel including base stats is necessary?

No, but they show the reader that you've put time and energy into something useless :D

Yes in that for design, movement speed and attack range are essential to know, especially if they are ranged.

How long do you normally spend on a champion concept? If varying, what's the longest you've spent?

Gnarr took me 2 months, I grappled with him for what seemed like an eternity (Which is probably why he will always be my favorite champion :P). For other concepts, I try post at least every 2 weeks, although that has been delayed recently as I am trying to brood more on design.

Do you approach a champion as a character or a game element?

Character! My personal philosophy is that one doesn't create champions, they find them.

What's your favorite champion concept on the CB right now that isn't your own?

Grak, the Vile Scavenger, I would say by far, but recently there have been an influx of great concepts! Still a classic for me.

How do you like to format your concepts? (i.e. Lore, then kit, then jokes, etc.)

Shameless plugging time! Gnarr, The Harvester As an example. I show a picture of what the champion will look like, write a small teaser that varies on being a teaser, personality intro, or short story.

Then, it goes Lore, Base Stats, Kit, Description (if any), FAQ, other concepts, and SKINS!!!

Thinking back to your first concept, what do you wish you knew then that you know now?

I wish that I could make my concept (Gnarr) more clear. Clarity is essential in order for the reader to enjoy the concept, hence why I now always include a FAQ.

Any advice for new champion concept makers?

Don't give up, take your time, and I most likely read yours anyway :P

MercsGuardian7/8/2014, 4:36:06 PM2 votes

Hardest part for me was and still is the VA lines, I'm sh*t at coming up with special phrases, the most recent champ I posted was 75% modified Zed/Nocturne quotes and then the rest was mostly special taunts at the Shadow Isles champs.

The easiest for me was the abilities and coming up with cool ideas for them, the only champion where I've had to basically use someone else's idea was again my last champion and that was just the ultimate.

I usually get the stats for abilities from already existing ones, or I post very straight forward numbers and if someone thinks I should lower or raise them I do just that.

Base stats are not absolutely necessary, but it's one less thing Riot needs to worry about if/when they decide to use that champion concept. Also, it's easier to do them if you look at champions who have a similar position(Fighter, Assassin, Tank, etc.) to the champion you are creating, example, if you are making a Tank champion, looking at the base stats of Mundo and Shen is a good way to get stat suggestion and then modifying them so that the champ has a certain power curve in damage and defense.

Normally it's 2-4 months, but the longest one is the one I'm currently working on right now which was started over 7 months ago and hasn't been completed because of school and other things.

I try to make them as a game element, because I've added some unique things into a various champions of mine, an example is a reverse Quinn W which blocks out vision for the enemy in a large radius. Another was an artillery bombardment ult that makes the GP ult look like it's falling snow. I'm not good with lore or VA lines so the character's are not really there, but the kit is.

My favorites that are not mine...I really like the Hextech Kickstarter concept, I considered making a champion like that at one point, but decided against it because I was having a hard time coming up with abilities.

My concept set up is as follows;

Name and role
Stats
Description(since I can't draw for sh*t)
Abilities
Joke, Taunt, Dance, and possible skins
VA lines
Recommended build
A little bit of a backstory because that can easily be reworked into an actual, more League friendly backstory.

Back when I made my first champion I wish I had known that Yasuo was going to be an actual release from Riot because I've gone back and changed not one, but two champs because of him...that Wall, I had an idea for it on two very early champs I created...both I traded out for more basic abilities because I thought a projectile weakening(Guardian) wall and a projectile blocking(Night) wall were going to be too strong.

Also, this is quite the thing, so many people have posted here. Hopefully people draw from ideas and style changes from this.

ploki1228/5/2014, 2:55:50 AM1 votes

What's the most difficult part of creating a champion in your opinion?

Personally, I feel like the hardest is the single last ability. The way I create my champions, the first 1-2 abilities are often "freebies" based on the core concept of it,, the next 2 try to round the kit together, and then you have the last piece that has to both fill in a gap and convey the champion's personality. For instance If you look at Ziggs, I could easily see his Bouncing Bomb and Satchel being created early in the process and kept relatively as-is, because it's pretty "on concept". Then you can add the minefield and a semi-global gigantic explosion to give a little more sieging/burtsy/poke-y mage. Then, you're stuck trying to find a passive that conveys his slightly maniac, explosive dude, giving him some better burst without making it too accessible (since the rest of his kit is safe).

What's the easiest?

Easiest is technically the "basic idea". For instance saying I'll do a "toymaker" or "someone who revolves around tanking damage for allies" or something like that. I say it's technically the easiest, because I'm not searching for concepts, I'm developping them as they come, so it's the only step I'm not waiting on. Otherwise, the first 1-2 abilities are often pretty straightforward too since they simply reflect the core aspect of the champion.

When designing the kit, how do you get a baseline for the numbers?

I'm not too hard on the numbers. I usually just look at similar abilities and use the exact same numbers +/- 10 for base and scaling, either similar in design (for instance a vector AoE damage like Victor's laser, or in purpose for instance a self-buff ultimate with little to no immediate effect like Singed's). Then, near the end, I try to imagine 3 different teamfights, 1 going terribly wrong, 1 going terribly well, and a starndard one, and try to find any outlying problems. One thing that helps me is that I never put down mana costs since they really feel too volatile to me to theorycraft them.

Do you feel including base stats is necessary?

Hard base stats, no. Heck, I feel like it simply bogs down your concept by adding noise to it. One of the first thing that happens the patch after a release is a base stat tweaking. If your champion has something special about it, you may want to add base stat hints (a note saying that your champion has higher than normal or ~360 base movement speed. Or maybe saying that your champion has really high base armor but no scaling). I usually add special interactions and quotes before even thinking of adding stats.

How long do you normally spend on a champion concept? If varying, what's the longest you've spent?

On average, From the ground up to something that I would accept posting it's 3-6 hours of actual theory crafting (at that point I have a "lore direction", name+title, and a full kit). If I want to polish it a bit, I can go for weeks. I had made an "Udyr mage" (aka no ultimate) quite a while ago that I think I tweaked and modified abilities for months. Spent easily like 60 hours on it at the very least.

Do you approach a champion as a character or a game element?

I think that I'd say I juggle both. At first, I start with a character, to have something cohesive to develop. I recently chose to flesh out a WolfManAXeBoss champion, so I started by wondering "what would ManWolfAxeBoss be in a Runeterra environment". Then, after I have the overall direction of the kit, I flesh it out as a game element, or basically an extremely complicated item. Once the kit is done, I look back at it from a character perspective, and check if nothing feels out of place, jot down a terribly rough lore and re-check abilities to make sure they don't awkwardly conflict with it.

So in short, I create it as a character, but develop it as a game element.

[finished in reply]

Dragon Fang Shot7/9/2014, 12:10:21 AM1 votes

I haven't officially made a champion concept, but it's an idea that's been floating through my head. I've got two champ ideas floating in my head in particular, and there's something I've noticed about them. For one, they're different. One is a support who can cast all her abilities on an ally or enemy, with different effects for each. Her passive then increases her ability's powers when used successively on an ally, and her successive ability casts on enemies increases the power of the ability on an enemy. The other one is a utility top lane/jungle fighter, whose ultimate deals no damage, but is instead a giant AoE CC, but where he is would be the center of the cast (much like the recent change to Maokai's ultimate, but my champion's is stationary).

The other thing about them is, although they're different, they still fit common tropes. The support is much like the statue Lady Justice (Google it if you don't know what it is, you'll recognize it), as in she is all about scales. Using abilities on an ally adds a stack of her passive to increase other abilities cast on allies, as if she is adding to her scale on the side of justice. the same can be said about her ability casts on enemy add to the side of the scale that represents punishment. The other one is a sand worm. In his lore, he has terrorized the Shuriman desert for ages, and has many worm-like abilities he can dig through the ground and sense movement around him.

Be original, but don't be afraid to have influences.

The Dunkmaster7/10/2014, 9:57:49 AM1 votes

Just made my first champion concept here

Wouldn't say I was very experienced yet although I can share my experience making Thundaron.

Most difficult part for making a champion is definitely coming up with kit ideas that fit the champion AND the rest of their kit, because if you don't then you end up with Sion

The easiest is probably the base numbers for abilities

Designing the kit personally I looked at similar numbers for that certain champion's role for example making Thundaron I based my numbers off of Xerath because he's the most similar champion I could find to Thundaron in terms of range/power.

Base stats are necessary for getting into technical things like numbers, a champion should always have base stats if you go into the base damage/mana cost territory (I'm guilty of not doing this) but my point still stands, you can have a champion with high mana costs but a low mana pool and regen (Looking at Sion again) and it just won't work.

Thundaron I spent the whole day thinking about the concept of totems that bounce or extend lightning around, I got around to making him about 2-3 hours ago.

Haven't really looked much but so far it has to be Saya, the Hextech Kickstarter Before I really got into making Thundaron I had the exact same resource system for him and he was actually a tanky lockdown support instead of CC mage.

I don't do lore/voice etc for my concepts, I'm only really interested in making kits with numbers that function.

N/A, I've only made 1 full concept so far.

Sir ArmaMalum7/8/2014, 3:44:10 PM1 votes

I’ll start!

What's the most difficult part of creating a champion in your opinion?

The freakin names. Everytime. I can have a kit, lore, VA lines and everything down to the freaking underwear he/she uses on what day of the week, but for the life of me I can never find the ‘right’ name.

What's the easiest?

The jokes, if I have a kit and lore down, the character’s usually fleshed out enough to think of some funny lines. I have one requirement though, at least 1 pun.

When designing the kit, how do you get a baseline for the numbers?

Personally I look at abilities in the live game that closely resemble what I’m going for, base stats included. Failing that, I try to think of the highest possible abuse case the ability can have and scale it back if it’s too high. Naturally I’m not too practiced so I still gotta work on what I deem allowable.

Do you feel including base stats is necessary?

I’m on the fence on this one. It’s a nice bit of added detail, as well as a good show of your detailed game knowledge, but as far as audience goes I don’t feel like there’s enough demand for it to justify the space it takes. I try to keep this section as small as possible to keep it from taking away from the juicier kit and lore sections. (#IWANTSPOILERFUNCTION >_<)

How long do you normally spend on a champion concept? If varying, what's the longest you've spent?

I’ve been working on my second entry off and on for a little less than a month now….If I had no other pressing things to do I could probably hammer one out in three days, one full day if it’s a really cool idea.

Do you approach a champion as a character or a game element?

Game element. Although I really do enjoy writing, I’m a gamer before a writer. For me kits just come easier, although I’m still pretty green at placing cc in appropriate places in appropriate amounts.

What's your favorite champion concept on the CB right now that isn't your own?

I’m sorry, I can’t, I simply can’t. Too many good ones.

How do you like to format your concepts? (i.e. Lore, then kit, then jokes, etc.)

Still messing around with it but right now it's:

Lore --> Physical Description --> Kit --> VO Lines (jokes, taunts etc.) --> Extras (Base stats, unique (non-VO) interactions, etc etc) --> Art (this is almost always blank :P)

Thinking back to your first concept, what do you wish you knew then that you know now?

-Taking a deeeep breath before reading feedback, even if it’s positive. I’m proud of keeping an open mind, but a champ concept (like any original writing or art) is a bit more of an emotional investment than most, and I surprised myself at my reaction to my first concept’s feedback.

-How much a character’s lore and personality can make a kit work or not work. I usually approach the kit first and then make the lore, but if I like a bit of lore I’m writing I’ll go back and change the kit around to make it work. It just feels so wrong if the kit doesn’t represent the character appropriately in my eyes.

-The benefit of re-writing lore. Several times over. I’ve taken my fair share of writing classes and written a good amount of fiction on my spare time but still have yet to write something I liked on the first try. Hell, I usually feel it’s worse on the second edit even, but in this case victory goes to the tenacious. At least in my experience.