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SpookyNA Team Getting DQ'd By a Few Seconds, and Why it matters. NACS

Lord Ace··81 votes·17,875 views

Hey Everyone, Tiza (RIOT) referred me here to discuss what went on to defend my team from being DQ'd. So my mid laner has an emergency before the match, and we search for the mid lane sub, who isn't responding to his cellphone. We get the top lane sub to play for mid, but he gets in at 3:10. Not before 3:10.

Why this matters?

According to the rules stated by this link at "https://battlegrounds.s3-eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/pdfs/csoq/rules.pdf"

We recommend that teams be online 10 minutes prior to the official start time to provide ample time to enter the custom game lobby and get ready. Five members from the team roster must be in the lobby at the stated time. Fewer than five players will not constitute a valid team. If a valid team is not in the lobby 10 minutes after the tournament start time, the team captain must contact an adjudicator via the game chat lobby that is provided through email so that the adjudicator can enter the game and confirm the team has failed to show.

At 3:10 our sub is in the game, which, if Tiza had joined, s/he would have seen that and we would have been able to start the match. My team had even asked if the other team is ready, at which point the enemy team said no, and then got confirmation after 3:10 to leave the match. After an hour, the other team played to the better side of Tiza in hopes of a good decision for them, which they received. All this for a few seconds. The other team was available to play, but the decision had been made. Now in the time of an emergency, a few seconds delay to the deadline, is a DQ. This team had high chances of becoming top 2 for this tournament, and due to a few seconds, apparently it is not so.

We provided reasoning, even utilizing the rules provided, for the tournament to be played. I was told that I was arguing and being nit picky, albeit all I did was use the same article of the rule being used against my team. We offered to lose the first match, which is a huge disadvantage in a bo3, and Tiza didn't even allow for that. We would have given up anything to play this official match. This is the only shot for our team, which has a long time until the next split to have a chance, to have a chance at getting into the LCS. Do I have to be a millionaire to field a team into the LCS?

Is there anything we can do to play a match? Or is it a few seconds too late?

121 Comments

RiotTiza43 votes

Posting my reply here as well as your Reddit thread:

Hey all, wanted to clarify some of the points here. OP's team, "Spooky NA Team," was disqualified for being late for their match today. The game was scheduled at 3:00pm PST, and they were not in the lobby at 3:00pm. As they state, they did not get their 5th player into the lobby until after the 10 minute grace period had expired. While we are very sympathetic to the circumstances, we cannot have a slippery slope by giving extra extensions past the 10 minute grace period.

The purpose of having an Adjudicator join the lobby is to verify the no-show and have an official witness in case of a dispute. In this case, there is no dispute - both teams agreed up front that OP's team missed the cutoff. Additionally, the opposing team provided timestamped screenshots and a video recording that corroborates the timeline.

Ultimately, the 10 minute period is designed to provide ample cushion for real life problems. While we know there is always high stakes for CS tournament matches, we have to draw the line somewhere and hold firm.

Lord Ace8 votes

So if we just decided to lie, would have been fine?

Baron of Bread9 votes

Probably not considering that "the opposing team provided timestamped screenshots and a video recording that corroborates the timeline," so you couldn't have gotten away with the lie.

Lord Ace14 votes

One can edit a monitor's clock, that's the only time used

Itanx10 votes

Exactly, how can they punish you for being late, yet not punish the Tiza, who's JOB it is, as well as PER RULE to be the adjudicator (this guy literally gets paid to do this). Claiming that their is video evidence? that's not in the rules, and you are now rewarding outside video evidence? this then sets precedence that each team has to record video evidence (failed logic). What if the OP were in the other teams shoes and didn't record video evidence? Tiza needs to apologize to not only the OP for this mishandled event, but as well as the statement of him being nit picky, how dare you criticize someone for stating the rules, and inquiring in on your judgement, as well as making a claim that their isn't an argument. Tiza, you messed up and you represent Riot as well as the community, apologize.

Baron of Bread8 votes

The Adjudicator was not late. They arrived when they were notified that there was an absence and were not required to be there before that. While there was hard evidence to show that OP's team was tardy, it was not used as OP and the other team both said that OP's team was late.

Tiza acted in accordance with the rules and does not need to apologize for doing so.

Mofl III8 votes

Actually it is. There is a rule that you can disqualified if you forge any proof that an official of the tournament requires during any proccess. If you have any evidence you can send it in and Riot can accept it. If someone contests them and they are forged than the person who send it gets problems.

Xonra2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mofl III,realm=EUW,application-id=9hBQwnEU,discussion-id=wJEU8TOU,comment-id=000600000000000000000001,timestamp=2015-12-13T10:07:45.854+0000)

Actually it is. There is a rule that you can disqualified if you forge any proof that an official of the tournament requires during any proccess. If you have any evidence you can send it in and Riot can accept it. If someone contests them and they are forged than the person who send it gets problems.

The problem here is, there was no one to prove otherwise, as it seems there was no one in the lobby with the two teams (as was stated there is supposed to be to validate proof and time of the lateness, etc), so who would contest it aside from hearsay from the team DQ'd?

when you are scrambling to get your sub in, you aren't thinking about recording the time, unlike the team that was obviously banking on getting a free pass due to DQ, who had nothing else to think about during the 10 minute window. I'm not saying they DID falsify the time, but it is pretty easy to do, and near impossible to prove given the information shared by Tiza and the OP.

Prozzak5 votes

You would have to be falsifying the time from before the match even started to be grouped up. Not sure who would bother to be faking it that long as I am sure this rarely ever happens where someone is late. Video is likely from about 5 minutes prior to start time all the way to 10 minutes after so that would be a lot to edit the timer. All Riot has to then do is make sure the clock is going normal speed.

Of course, with the above I am assuming a couple things.

Baron of Bread2 votes

Then you can check to see how long that file has existed and check that against what the current time is as well as checking that computer to be sure it shows the correct time if you want. It is not hard to verify times.

Xonra2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Baron of Bread,realm=NA,application-id=9hBQwnEU,discussion-id=wJEU8TOU,comment-id=00060000000000000001,timestamp=2015-12-13T09:22:43.201+0000)

Then you can check to see how long that file has existed and check that against what the current time is as well as checking that computer to be sure it shows the correct time if you want. It is not hard to verify times.

Not directly arguing the point of if something was falsified, but it is VERY easy to edit a file to make it look like it was created at X time. It is VERY easy to change the time on your computer to say, 3:12, but do it at 3:10, but not present this evidence until 3:15. Simply by editing the video and saving it as a new format for example, it would show the edited time, not the created time.

Your entire argument is wrong, unfortunately, as it is very easy to falsify all of the information you described.

Baron of Bread2 votes

You are assuming that there is a decent chunk of time between when they take the screenshots/video and when they show them to an Adjudicator. Editing and then saving the video can take a decent amount of time. Since the Adjudicator is supposed to join the lobby very shortly after the 10 minutes there isn't enough time to doctor the files effectively, if at all.

AngryScrub1 votes

Let's be real here. If your team didn't have the forethought to have a sub ready to go in the event that something like that happened then they probably are not a top tier team. Don't blame Riot for your lack of organization.

TurquoiseYoshi38 votes

1: 10 minutes isn't enough. At the very least, try to find out what is going on with the team. Do you want a bad team making it in because of accident, or a good team making it in a few minutes late? Remember, only a Sith deals in absolutes.

2: Were you not there? The post and your response have been pretty unclear on it. If no Rioters were there, at a CHALLENGER SERIES match, maybe there are bigger problems to look at.

Valthan31 votes

I think the second point here is the most important. The administrator should also be held accountable for being late.

Xonra5 votes

{quoted}

I think the second point here is the most important. The administrator should also be held accountable for being late.

That is the flaw in the ENTIRE thing: Riot has no accountability, because who is holding them accountable aside from their biased selves?

That would be like someone telling me to hold myself accountable in a game, then I choose to cheat, but then pardon myself of punishment, because I'm the only one holding me accountable I enforce my own rules upon myself and that's the final say.

Rawr Cougar Rawr14 votes

They were given a scheduled start time that they knew about in advance, and are even granted 10 additional minutes that don't need to be granted as is. How long do you think is 'fair' for a grace period? Should the rule be changed to say "10 additional minutes plus an additional 15 seconds"? Should a team be given an additional 15 seconds on top of the other 15 seconds if they happen to miss that first window of additional time? Would it be fair to the other team to be forced to wait 20-30 minutes past the scheduled start time because this team can't be bothered to show up on time?

TendajiX4 votes

"Emergency" , some leniency should have been allowed, nobody is gonna die over another second or 2.[slayer-jinx-unamused]

Narasimha9 votes

The 10 minutes IS for the emergency. If you don't set a limit and impose it, then anything becomes debatable.

TendajiX4 votes

But in the case of an emergency, you're telling me a couple seconds past grace is unacceptable? That is a cruel , harsh punishment considering what is at stake.

Narasimha7 votes

If a few seconds were 'acceptable', then whats the purpose of the deadline in the first place? When someone sets the limit, that is the LIMIT. Not a suggestion. Not a guideline. When a manager says "I want this project done by CoB today." It's not 'CoB and then a few minutes more."

TendajiX3 votes

The thing is this isn't minutes, this si seconds. Seconds could literally be the client lagging when you click to enter the lobby. Also, my boss wouldn't fire me for being late if say me or a loved one was in a serious car crash and was 20 seconds late. The issue here is a utter lack of humanity, empathy, sympathy, ect. We aren't robots, we have compassion. If you don't, well then you are a sociopath and should see a therapist -_-.

Narasimha9 votes
  1. It's seconds being late after the grace period of 10 minutes. The grace period which EXISTS to give people time to be late.
  2. To use your own example, your boss would not fire you if you were seconds late in that incident because it's personal. However, if he gave you a project due in a week, and you submitted it late because at the last instant an accident happened, then he/she would look down on you sharply. Why? Because you had AMPLE time. And that's the point here. You had been given enough time. If you fail to meet the deadline, for any reason other than the absolute extenuating (e.g. you got hit by a car on the 2nd day.), then the fault lies with you.
  3. I have compassion when it's required. A team being disqualified because they failed to be prepared doesn't fit the criteria for that.
  4. I DO see a therapist. Well, did, don't have much time for it anymore. Ass.
TendajiX2 votes

Why would i be an ass if i was right -_-

Narasimha7 votes

Would you call a mentally handicapped person 'retarded' to their face? Because you're right there too.

Truth is important, perhaps above all else. But presentation of it is equally vital.

Spizzle90006 votes

I fail to see how you are acting like a sociopath. This is a game. It's not life or death to be DQd. You're acting logically, which is far better than acting like touchy-feely, headstrong people. Riot NEEDS to draw a line somewhere because if they let this slide, then if I were a minute past the 10 minute-long grace period, I'd use the excuse that they let 15 seconds slide, so why not 60? It goes on and on.

"If you give an inch, they'll take a mile."

TendajiX1 votes

Well someone would have to tell them eventually so that they could receive care/education/etc. Not telling someone retarded that they are retarded doesn't make it where they won't require special education. Pointing it out doesn't make me mean or wrong, esp if it supports my reasoning.

Narasimha5 votes

You're misunderstanding, intentional or not.

I didn't say 'Tell them'.

I said 'Call them'.

The former, in this situation, implies a passing of knowledge The latter implies malice.

Narasimha2 votes

In that case, no worries. I'm fully aware of my own sociopathic tendencies.

ABlueQuaker4 votes

k, if a family member starts bleeding out and I have to get them to the hospital I deserve to be DQed and I'm not allowed to plead my, incredibly valid, case.

Narasimha13 votes
  1. Call your team on the way. You have a responsibility to them too.
  2. You have substitutes for this EXACT purpose. This is literally what they're there for.

Now, if even the substitutes weren't ready to play, which is the issue here, then that's simply a lack of preparation.

Xonra3 votes

{quoted}

1: 10 minutes isn't enough. At the very least, try to find out what is going on with the team. Do you want a bad team making it in because of accident, or a good team making it in a few minutes late? Remember, only a Sith deals in absolutes.

2: Were you not there? The post and your response have been pretty unclear on it. If no Rioters were there, at a CHALLENGER SERIES match, maybe there are bigger problems to look at.

  1. Riot doesn't care the circumstances sadly. I know that sounds rude to state, but it is a fact proven over years.
  • 1:b) They will however change their stance on "Caring" depending on the people or circumstances. This is the main reason this bothers me, because if this were some high profile team in this situation exactly, you know they would have bent over backwards, and none of this would have even gotten out until maybe a month from now and some full page explanation of why they were given special treatment. Basically the rules are absolute and they have to draw a line somewhere......until they don't, because "reasons".
  1. It sounds like there was no actual judicator IN the lobby at the time, because someone had to be fetched. That in itself is pretty shifty as if there is no one there to prove the time, then how could they say one way or another, outside of hearsay and after the fact "proof".
Prozzak2 votes

Video proof. Wow, that was difficult.

Nyxu20 votes

The purpose of having an Adjudicator is irrelevant if the rules explicitly state that one must be contacted by the opposing team captain, so that the Adjudicator can verify a no-show. If the captain did not notify an Adjudicator, and an Adjudicator did not verify the no-show, then the entire process is defective at its core.

If your intention is to 'draw the line' and 'hold firm', consider the slippery slope argument for not requiring Adjudicator presence. By introducing the precedent of testimonial evidence as opposed to firsthand evidence in this case, the basis of the rule is eroded.

Xengre4 votes

{quoted}

The purpose of having an Adjudicator is irrelevant if the rules explicitly state that one must be contacted by the opposing team captain, so that the Adjudicator can verify a no-show. If the captain did not notify an Adjudicator, and an Adjudicator did not verify the no-show, then the entire process is defective at its core.

If your intention is to 'draw the line' and 'hold firm', consider the slippery slope argument for not requiring Adjudicator presence. By introducing the precedent of testimonial evidence as opposed to firsthand evidence in this case, the basis of the rule is eroded.

Yup, this incident is embarrassing and extremely unprofessional. I'm really not surprised with Riot taking shortcuts. We see this with the message boards, with how they handle major tournament events, with their own client and programming, with their communication in general, etc. Amazing that such a profitable company can try so hard to take the easy route.

ChaoticPinecone2 votes

If the OP was stating that the 5th member showed up seconds before the cutoff and the opposing party stated the 5th member showed up seconds after the cutoff, its an entirely different situation. But in this case, the OP is asking for leniency that his 5th member showed up seconds after the cutoff. The enemy team is asking for the DQ because the 5th member showed up seconds after the cutoff.

The adjudicator didnt assume what one side said was true and what the other side said was false. What happened isnt in debate. Both teams agreed on what happened. I dont see how the rule is eroded if there is no conflicting testimony.

Lao Fu the Tiger18 votes

While I respect the rules, I would like to point out two things I noticed as a member of a nationally ranked Ethics Bowl team. All we do is study and debate ethics and ethical theory behind grey area matters similar to this. I mean no disrespect, but these are the problems I see with your statement.

First, any argument that hinges on a "slippery slope" is recognized as a logical fallacy; a slippery slope cannot and should not be used to justify any position, because it is founded upon the assumption that simply because one event happened, another is bound to occur, without any justification of the latter happening. In this instance, you make a point that it would be a "slippery slope" to give extra extension past the grace period (note: for less than a minute over), implying that it would encourage others to also be tempted to ask for an extension. However, this is clearly not the case. We cannot make the assumption that, "this sets precedence where we'd have to make the new cutoff time 11 minutes, then 12 minutes, etc." because:

  1. This is not something incredibly typical, it is an edge case, which generally should be treated slightly different than standard cases.
  2. The time given poses an insignificant margin past the current grace period.

As a short example, consider purchasing alcohol in the United States. The US is incredibly strict about making sure the person buying alcohol is 21 years old. However, I was born at 4:10 PM EST. I was not legally 21 years old until 4:10 PM on February 6, 2015, yet, I purchased my first drink legally around noon. I guarantee that if I told the bartender that I wasn't born until 4 PM, he would not restrict my purchase; it is an edge case that is treated with leniency, because it's a negligible period of time. I was not 21 years old yet, and somehow I was still legally allowed to purchase alcohol. In fact, this can be further extended to a more extreme case in which a person was born at 11:59 PM on a certain day and purchases his drink at 00:01 that same morning (not two minutes later, rather 23:58 minutes prior). It's not a matter of whether the person is 21 or not; it's not important.

Second, I'd like to address your statement regarding "drawing the line somewhere and holding firm." This is another poor consideration, considering the precedence within much more heavy situations than a simple disqualification. As a far-fetched example, in several states, children as low as age 16 can be treated as an adult, despite their minor status as recognized by the government. This is a bending of the typical rules in an edge case matter.

My father always used this wonderful analogy of exactly, to the letter, what you described. It involves the classic "spirit of the law" vs. "letter of the law."

There is a subway station in New York that doesn't allow sleeping in the station at night. There are two men sitting on two separate benches. The first man is sitting up, dozing off while he waits for the last train after a long day of work. The second man isn't asleep, but he has a blanket, pillow, some food, and is lying down on the bench. Which person gets punished?

If what the OP says is true and the sub was there at 3:10, maybe a few seconds late, you are arguing that we should punish the man who was simply dozing off. Was that what the intent of the law was trying to prohibit? Obviously not; the law was there to prevent people like the man who wasn't yet asleep, but was setting up camp. If, however, the sub legitimately was late (I know people tend to exaggerate on these forums), then I stand by your ruling. But saying that a team should be disqualified for being ready at 3:10:20 rather than 3:10:00 is a little absurd.

Itanx6 votes

I don't even have to read your post entirely, how can you understand the ruling? it's a failed conclusion simply based on the fact their was no adjudicator. I'll leave with a small point, and can respond accordingly if you wish.

Tiza claims they can't set precedent by breaking the rules set in which the 10 minute grace period allows, yet he sets a precedent of accepting outside evidence, to replace his job as an adjudicator.

Let's assume the video is correct, and unedited - fine. But this again sets a precedent in which the adjucitor is no longr required, and video evidence is essentially a MUST in any turny (challenger series)

What happens if their wasn't video evidence? or OP didn't admit to wrong doing.

ChaoticPinecone3 votes

I love logic so ill be the devil's advocate:

The United States law (its actually state law which dictates 21 as the year, but whatever) recognizes that time can be measured in different intervals. Technically, you could count down to an infinitesimally small unit of time to measure your age. They could have measured it by the month, so in February you could have purchased a drink. They could have measured it by the hour, so you might have to wait until 4 to purchase that drink. They could have measured it to the minute so you would have to wait until 4:10. They could have measured it to the second so you would have to wait until 4:10:XX. But they didnt. They decided to go with the DATE of birth, not hour or minute of birth.

Its not an edge treated with leniency. An edge treated with leniency would be like purchasing your first drink on 10:00pm the night before your birthday. In this situation, the cutoff point was when the clock strikes 12, not because it was the actual time of birth, but because state legislature recognized it was the easiest and simplest way to keep track of age. The laws are written with a 24 hour window in mind. If youre in that window, you qualify to state that day as your Date of Birth for purchasing alcohol, even if you are at the extremes of both ends.


Slipperly slopes are a informal logical fallacy, not a formal one. Formal logical fallacies are fallacious by nature, and should not be used to argue a point. But keep in mind that violating the fallacies doesnt always mean its false.

Take the classic example of a formal logical fallacy: If its raining outside, I will get wet. I got wet. So it must be raining. This is a fallacious argument since there might be other causes of getting wet. Does that mean its not raining? Not necessarily. It could be raining, which is why i got wet. But it could have been from another source of water as well, so the logic is false whether or not your conclusion is true.

Informal Logical Fallacies are fallacious, but not due to logic. They are fallacious by relying on human tendencies and generalizations. Again, this doesnt mean they arent true or dont describe the world correctly. its an informal logical fallacy because its something to keep you suspicious of the argument, not outright denying it. (Outright denying Informal Logical Fallacies is a fallacy in itself, BTW). Informal Logical Fallacies require more insight to determine truth than formal logical fallacies, since nothing about the claim is inherently false.

For example, take this argument - The sun rose every day for the past million years, so the sun will rise again tomorrow. Thats an informal logical fallacy. Is it false? I dont know (and nobody can). But would you bet that I'm going to be wrong? Informal logical fallacies are everywhere, and cannot be avoided. Whether you recognize it or not, you rely on informally fallacious reasoning every single day.

Similarly slipperly slope arguments arent always wrong, I wont give an example, since it would make this post about 3 times as long, but there are instances in Law where it occurred. If you want one, ask and i shall give.


Letter of the Law vs Spirit of the Law is an interesting debate. For better or for worse, generally the Letter of the Law wins, because one of the main focuses of written law is having the ability to read the law if you so desire. If the laws were not codified by statue, you would never know when a law changes. Unfortunately, the Letter of the Law isnt always clear, coherent, or legal (due to many factors, primarily that Legislatures dont know the law, dont account for how its interpreted, or that laws go through dozens of amendments before being codified, so the final product doesnt look anything like the original). Then the courts can go to the "spirit" of the law, evidenced by congressional debates and briefs, as long as it isnt blatantly in conflict with the letter of the law.

this is my roundabout way of saying that in this case, the Letter of the Law states that anything past the scheduled time is late, but you get a 10 minute grace period. We can argue about what the Spirit of the Law is (and only the person/people who wrote the rule will know) - is it to discourage "dozing off" opposed to "setting up camp"? (i dont understand that metaphor). Or is it to discourage being late in any way shape or form, but knowing that an absolute no-tardy rule would be too absurd? What happens if 2 people wrote the rule, one thinking that it was to discourage "setting up camp" and the other thinking it was a no-show rule?


EDIT - my bad, i didnt read your post thoroughly enough. I get your letter vs spirit metaphor now. I would say that neither are in violation of the law. The law prohibits sleeping, so the one setting up camp isnt sleeping, and therefore, isnt in violation of any law. The other, who is dozing off, isnt not in the proper mindset that his consciousness is lost to be "sleeping".

And secondly about your point with Juveniles, there IS a hard cutoff. Most states have a codified rule with the exception at 16 (some at 13, some that have another exception for murder). Juveniles under 18 are charged as Juveniles with more lenient sentencing, but the system codified a 2 year buffer for serious crimes. This situation is similar with, with the rule at 3:00 but with a 10 minute buffer. In the states where a 16 year old may be charged as an adult, a 15-and-11-month cannot.

Mofl III4 votes

Actually in your example you have a clear case of stright enforced rules. If you take twins that were born at 23:59 and 0:01 so on different days. The older twin would be allowed to drink alcohol one day earlier than the other een though it is only 2 minutes between them. Just because the goverment doesn't care at which hour you were born doesn't mean that the lowest unit they use is fluid and forgiving. It is more a tradeoff between accurate information and administrative costs to get them (against their value). You don't even consider the differences in timezone for your example. The goverment would for example allow one person to drink while the other person isn't because one was born at 1:30 at the east coast and one 3 timezones to the west at 22:30 (assuming they use local times for birth certificates). They are exactly the same age if they try to drink together and still one is served and one isn't.

Phaketoh2 votes

{quoted}

Posting my reply here as well as your Reddit thread:

Hey all, wanted to clarify some of the points here. OP's team, "Spooky NA Team," was disqualified for being late for their match today. The game was scheduled at 3:00pm PST, and they were not in the lobby at 3:00pm. As they state, they did not get their 5th player into the lobby until after the 10 minute grace period had expired. While we are very sympathetic to the circumstances, we cannot have a slippery slope by giving extra extensions past the 10 minute grace period.

The purpose of having an Adjudicator join the lobby is to verify the no-show and have an official witness in case of a dispute. In this case, there is no dispute - both teams agreed up front that OP's team missed the cutoff. Additionally, the opposing team provided timestamped screenshots and a video recording that corroborates the timeline.

Ultimately, the 10 minute period is designed to provide ample cushion for real life problems. While we know there is always high stakes for CS tournament matches, we have to draw the line somewhere and hold firm.

You obviously have to follow your current rules to the dot but don't you think they should be amended in the future to give some leniency for cases like this? Losing bans or even losing the first game of the Bo3 as they suggested sounds like more than enough to make up for teams being slightly late.

Mofl III2 votes

The applicable rule is the following rule for disqualification:

OQ Discretion​. Any other further act, failure to act, or behavior which, in the sole judgment of OQ officials, violates these Rules and/or the standards of integrity established by OQ for competitive game play.

Because there is no different rule that covers how to handle no-shows (only how to confirm them) the admins are forced to use your own judgement to disqualify teams that don't show up. They don't even have to confirm it theoretically. There is no requirement for them to reach any stage of confirmation.

It sounds like someone else just wrote a pretty crappy ruleset and the admins are now stuck with it and have to follow retarded procedures that don't belong in the rule (like showing up at exactly 10 min without earlier notice actually which is unpossible anyway) while actually disqualification reasons like not showing up not actually mentioned.

It is not Tiza's fault most likely that the rules are the way they are. They are neither pratical nor do they cover this case at all.

Old Man Teeto6 votes

We recommend that teams be online 10 minutes prior to the official start time to provide ample time to enter the custom game lobby and get ready. Five members from the team roster must be in the lobby at the stated time. Fewer than five players will not constitute a valid team. If a valid team is not in the lobby 10 minutes after the tournament start time, the team captain must contact an adjudicator via the game chat lobby that is provided through email so that the adjudicator can enter the game and confirm the team has failed to show.

This is the section that is relevant based on the post.

According to what is stated in this clause, at 3:10 the captain of the opposing team must contact the Adjudicator, to then join the lobby.

Question 1: Did an Adjudicator join the lobby to confirm an absence by JOINING THE GAME?

Question 2: Did the team have their members in the lobby prior to an Adjudicator joining the lobby?


If you want to hold firm to your stances, then hold firm to your procedure as well. If the Adjudicator wasn't there 3:10 to confirm, then you're flippant on your own stance.

ChaoticPinecone2 votes

You think so? Because when i read "Five members from the team roster must be in the lobby at the stated time" i read that as a requirement, not a suggestion.

Old Man Teeto2 votes

Their method of confirmation listed must be performed, since that is the ONLY listed method, not SS's, Time Stamps, etc.

When one team contests the legitimacy of a DQ, if something wasn't done properly from the same rulebook, and there isn't an overarching clause (which tbh, I didn't read the whole thing), they can legitimately appeal the DQ, which is what they're doing.

*Edit: Reading the chain that has popped up in earlier comments answers the questions. OP's team admitted to being a little late, Tiza made it into the lobby a little late when there were 10 players, both teams admitted to OP's team being late and Tiza made the eventual ruling. Based on this, technically it was a correct ruling, albeit heavily poor sportsman if it was just a few seconds post deadline from the opposing team, however in a competitive environment a free win is a free win.

Dengeden1 votes

Are there that many qualifying teams that you couldn't even let them play out a 4v5 for 1 match?

Elthision1 votes

The rules state that there need to be 5 players on each team. A 4v5 is not acceptable.

Dengeden1 votes

I mean... something to that gives up the first match but grants you more time.

Elthision1 votes

I don't get what you are trying to argue... The rules are the rules. If you don't like them, complain about them before they are being applied. Now it's to late to change the rules.

You can give feedback for future tournaments but this tournament runs on these rules.

Dengeden1 votes

It seems fair that you could forfeit the first match and get more time for it ... is what I'm trying to say. But rules are rules, you're right.

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