I just don't understand on a pro level why you would not want to fight your enemy at their best. Perma banning Aurelion sol off of Huni just feels like a sucker punch. I'm not taking sides on teams or anything, and other teams target ban aswell. I just want to watch good games, And it feels like banning peoples mains is a cheap way to win.
BigBellBrute7 votesWell CLG gave the jungler his favorite pick and look what happened.
Drehirth5 votesthis reminds me of watching a video about a riven player raging that a kennen is too much of a bitch to stand and fight him instead of kiting him
1 800 Top Lane1 votesThis is getting into something everyone just argues about. My only point is, How can you call yourselves the best, When you never even fought the best.
Drehirth7 votesa weak champion pool = a weak midlaner in tournaments. How can clg be the best with a weak midlaner?
The answer is they can't and aren't..
you can be salty but it's part of the game, and there are strategies in many sports that people cry about, but the truth is if it's part of the game then it's something you must deal with if you want to be the best...
1 800 Top Lane1 votesAs I said before, I'm not here to argue with you, and I'm not a CLG fan, Hardly salty. I guess I have a different standard of what someone being better than someone else is. Challenging a kingdom and having them tear down there walls so you can fight them, is hardly honorable.
Drehirth8 votesYou started a thread with a point for discussion and I am arguing against that point because that's how it works. If you can't handle people disagreeing with your opinion then don't bother posting it.
getting fed off of the other team's weakest lanes, counter picking to get lanes that are favorable also doesn't seem so honorable by your standards either, but they are also part of the game- where would you even draw the line on what's "honorable"- not to mention what would being "honorable" in your play style even get you in a tournament? nothing..
Your analogy is even worse. how honorable is it to have an advantage by having walls and shooting arrows down on soldiers trying to fight fairly?
what does being honorable in taking that walled city get you? more of your own soldiers deaths? not so honorable to surround the city and starve them out instead of fighting, but much smarter which is why it was a legitimate tactic when available..
Orinne6 votesSo what exactly is your point here?
You're pitying one trick pony Huhi for being banned out with one ban (in Worlds no less) by placing the onus on the enemy team for not being 'honorable'. That sounds like more a problem with Huhi needing to brush up on other mid options so he isn't banned out, not a problem with competitors lacking your nonexistent ideal.
CLG isn't even the best team going in (lowest NA seed, got 4th in the Summer Playoffs, but were fortunate enough to get enough CP to qualify) so it's not like ROX were fighting the best anyways. There's still plenty of mid-laners to watch with much better champion pools.
Limrick1 votesEveryone has a best champion though, and target bans are pretty cowardly. Smart, but cowardly.
The Whamboozler1 votesDude... when you are playing the game as your JOB you do "smart" things to win. If they don't ban out A-Sol and then get stomped, everyone would be talking about how dumb they were to not do so.
It's equally not "smart" to only be good with a handful of champs. Professionals should be able to handle themselves at the highest level of play no matter what it thrown at them. It's just stupid to expect the enemy team to handicap themselves and give you your comfort pick.
This is the same logic used by Trynd players in bronze. "OMFG coward, why no 1v1 me?". Because purposely fighting someone in a way that they are strong at isn't brave, it's stupid. I'm not gonna get into an AA slap fight with you unless I'm going to WIN an AA slap fight. If you wanna call yourself good, you have to FORCE ME into an AA slap fight. Just sitting there whining that no one is playing the way you want them to just make you look like an idiot.
Limrick1 votesI just said its a smart thing to do. Winning is what they are there to do, but that doesn't make it not cowardly. Banning out the enemies best champs is a solid strategy, and everyone has a best champ. You can be great at a bunch of champs, but Huhi has ASol, Dlift has Lucian, Westdoor has TF, you get the idea.
Immortal spax4 votesRox used their bans to all Likkrit's champion pool (Brand, Bard and Tahm) plus they first picked alistar. But guess what, he picked Taric and carried aniway.
Its no ones fault if huhi can play only one champ.
III BAKURYU III 3 votesIt's a strategy from the ROX TIgers. Huhi has over 100+ champions to choose from, god forbid he learns some instead of just relying on 1 champion every game. "Sucker Punch" "Cheap way" That's like in basketball the defender saying " I'm not going to guard the enemy player because it would be a cheap way to win".
I love CLG and NA but if a team that can be beaten in just the pick ban stage of the game doesn't deserve to go to QT Finals. CLG had plenty of time 2-3 weeks before WORLDS to come up with new picks but instead relied on the same 2 champions over and over again.
1 800 Top Lane1 votesI think saying I'm not a CLG fan is confusing people somehow and making them think I am a CLG fan.
I could care less what teams are who, I watch worlds as entertainment and want quality over quantity.
III BAKURYU III 2 votesI didn't get what you said confused I said " I love CLG and NA" I'm referring that while I love CLG and NA I will defend why ROX banned certain player's champions.
Let me rephrase and try to explain.
" I just don't understand on a pro level why you would not want to fight your enemy at their best"
Kinjishi2 votesThen why aren't you here asking for other teams not to target ban and only complaining about CLG being target banned?
AsphodelNext3 votesConsider this. They are playing a match which will decide whether or not they make it past the Group stage and have a chance at winning Worlds.
If they did not ban Aurelion Sol, and lost, it would be devastating. No team wants to risk losing so much for so little.
If you watched the first game between CLG and ROX, you would know that they already tried letting Huhi play Aurelion, with disasterous results which led to them playing this final match to get out of groups. There is no way that they would let that happen again.
Being the best at League isn't just about being good on one champion, or even about one player being the best. The whole team has to be the best, both in terms of strategy and mechanics. And yes, sometimes being the best means being humble enough to admit that you are unable to beat a particular composition from the enemy team, and banning it out, just as they would yours.
BigBellBrute2 votes[{quoted}](name=1 800 Top Lane,realm=NA,application-id=9hBQwnEU,discussion-id=ege4QJm3,comment-id=,timestamp=2016-10-07T05:12:27.220+0000)
I just don't understand on a pro level why you would not want to fight your enemy at their best.
Uh because pros want to maximize their chances of winning.
Doctor Jarvis1 votesUh...yeah. Yeah, thats the whole fucking point. Like, there's no other reason to ban. You ban whats strong. Huhi is a REALLY good Aurelion. Don't want to play against that, they would rather win. Like would you fault a football team for focusing coverage on...the best football players (shut up I don't know football players) because its just way better to watch when...I want to say Peterson(?) catches all the passes given to him. No, you want to gimp the opponents at every turn because you want to WIN
1 800 Top Lane1 votesI completely understand where you are coming from, but you can't call your team the best when you didn't fight them at their strongest.
My question is, why on a professional level do they not want to challenge themselves?
You don't start a football game and say hey, your best 3 players need to sit on the bench.
Doctor Jarvis1 votesI guess because there's no reason to. You have three bans, why not use them? Take what you can get to force the opponent to improve and challenge themselves. Huhi has to be able to play something besides Aurelion, and as long as he's being perma-banned he's going to have to challenge himself to improve his abysmal Syndra (for example)
BigBellBrute1 votes[{quoted}](name=1 800 Top Lane,realm=NA,application-id=9hBQwnEU,discussion-id=ege4QJm3,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2016-10-07T05:18:54.414+0000)
I completely understand where you are coming from, but you can't call your team the best when you didn't fight them at their strongest.
My question is, why on a professional level do they not want to challenge themselves?
You don't start a football game and say hey, your best 3 players need to sit on the bench.
Why would a pro football team rush a great QB. Don't they want him to beat him when he's throwing his best?
Obviously not. they want to smack him good so he isn't throwing his best.
1 800 Top Lane1 votesThe point that I'm making is, The pro QB gets to play. He's not banned and sitting on the bench.
Kinjishi1 votesEach team gets to ban 3 champs, it's fair. There are multiple champions that Huhi could play. It's not a matter of how good you are at 1 champion, it's a matter of how good you are at multiple champions. Take Faker for example, he is excellent at many champions. Bans don't matter against him because he has such a deep champion pool. As a mid-laner, Huhi is weak due to his champion pool being so small.
AkirisReed1 votesIt's vice versa then. CLG didn't fight ROX at their best, because the target banned Smeb. Aswell as they didn't fight ANX at their best, since they banned Brand-Anivia.
Utility Backline1 votes[{quoted}](name=1 800 Top Lane,realm=NA,application-id=9hBQwnEU,discussion-id=ege4QJm3,comment-id=,timestamp=2016-10-07T05:12:27.220+0000)
I just don't understand on a pro level why you would not want to fight your enemy at their best. Perma banning Aurelion sol off of Huni just feels like a sucker punch. I'm not taking sides on teams or anything, and other teams target ban aswell. I just want to watch good games, And it feels like banning peoples mains is a cheap way to win.
Wouldn't that mean, by your logic, Huhi is a cheap mid laner to employ since he only plays one champion? If they did not ban his Asol, wouldn't it be rather cheap if they won worlds all off of Huhi's one and only champion?
Angry Monster1 votesI read through this thread, you have a really weird POV.
Your argument is that other teams not playing against CLG at their best, cause they are at there best with SOL.
If CLG was the best they would not be hindered buy that one particular ban against them.
Sure CLG may have the best Sol player in the world on their team, but that does not even mean Sol is balanced and fair to play against (not arguing sol is balanced one way or another). In league being the best means adapting to a situation not having that one pick that no one can beat.
You are looking at this from the wrong point of view. Huni was at his best but did not get to have 1 tool at his disposal and the enemy team had the same restriction.
If you over specialize what happened to CLG is what happens to anyone. Also CLG did have to show this pick day 4. They could of stolen a few games today if they had kept it hidden. It was a poor strategic decision by CLG coaching staff to allow it being played.
Kal Vas Flam1 votesCLG target banned Smeb and Friends (formerly known as ROX Tigers) as well. It's called strategy.
The Whamboozler1 votesUm... those teams are trying to win. If you were trying to beat CLG, why the heck WOULDN'T you ban a champion that they've curb-stomped people with before?
It's not as if the teams are playing to make for the most entertaining game... they're playing to WIN. If you were playing against a team in pick up basketball and bans exist, you'd definitely ban their best players. Why should it be any different in any competitive sport?
Requiemsfire1 votesIt's called strategy. All teams use it, they prepare multiple rosters of champions to pick in the champion select phase with multiple compositions and work arounds just in case.It's not cheap, it's fundamental and principle to ensuring a competitive environment. Also the better teams adapt
It's actually funny, one game ANX get all their favourite comfort picks in a game with Brand, Anivia, and Poppy. Next game, the enemy team primarily bans Anivia and Brand straight up but instead still get stomped because ANX had prepared their own roster.
Then when they go up against ROX, ROX bans 3 support champions Brand, Tahm and Bard but gave ANX the Vladamir, the Nidalee, and the Poppy toplane. Big mistake. Rox tried to disrupt ANX's comp by banning out their support and hoped to snowball their botlane early on but ANX hasn't fully adhered to the current meta in fact a lot of their picks come by surprise which imo makes it all that more exciting.