Patch Chat with Playtest - Patch 6.3

RiotSkarnye West··1 votes·236,809 views

Hello!

We are Riot’s Playtest Team, a group of high ranking League players whose job it is to play the hell out of things (lane tests, competitive testing, etc) and give actionable, objective feedback to designers. Between us, we have experience as pro players, casters, coaches, analysts, and esports journalists. But above all, we are enthusiastic players of League of Legends, with an average of 3673 hours of gameplay each, and that’s just on our mains. If League of Legends were a 8-5 job, we’d be starting our 16th month on the job!

Every two weeks, we’re going to be hosting a discussion here on the state of balance on the current patch. Take this opportunity to ask us any questions about the state of the game because, as we said, it’s our job to analyze it from all angles.

This week, we’re going to discuss sleeper picks on 6.3, whether they’re the result of direct changes or a shifting landscape, or are simply champions that have remained underplayed despite strength in recent patches.


Let’s start with someone who’s been strong the last few patches but hasn’t seen much play. Feel like sometimes your team just holds you down? Try Nautilus; he’s used to carrying a heavy weight and making it look easy!

CJ’s Untara has been rocking Nautilus in the top lane; check out CJ Entus’ Week 4 games vs Longzhu Gaming for more!

Nautilus Top - Mattias “Gentleman Gustaf” Lehman Grasp of the Undying means it’s a good time to be big and beefy up top. Trundle, Dr. Mundo, and Tahm Kench all had their time in the spotlight before the nerf hammer brought them down to size. Who will rise to take their place? Malphite has remained rock steady as the second-highest win rate top laner (behind the explosive Graves), and the second-highest play rate top laner (behind Fiora).

But what about a top laner nobody has noticed lurking beneath the waves? Nautilus smashes both Malphite and Fiora, while taking on old favorites like Dr. Mundo, Gangplank, Gnar, Jax, and Riven. He enables ganks with a ridiculous four CC abilities, and scales well into teamfights thanks to his initiation potential and heavy peel. He still loses pretty hard to Graves, but let’s be real, we’re all banning him anyway.

On the itemization front, a perfect storm has been brewing. Sunfire Cape got an armor buff in 6.1 and a buff to minion damage in 6.3, giving Naut an easy first buy choice. Additionally, the Iceborn Gauntlet preseason changes allowed him to itemize for damage, tankiness, and heavy CDR all at the same time. Add Boots of Swiftness and your opponents will be left with nothing but a sinking feeling as they try to escape.

If you do happen to run into a Nautilus top lane, don’t try to out-CC him. Instead, pick a champion who will outscale him in 1v1 fights, and force him to lose split-push duels against you. Garen, Darius, Trundle, and Nasus should all do the trick with their sustain and relentless damage.


Runic Echoes Runic Echoes gave a number of junglers a hearty bump, but other than Elise and Nidalee - the usual suspects - and a surprise visit from AP Udyr, most AP junglers remain underpicked.

Diana Jungle - Trevor “ThEntropist” Thernes Despite a nearly 5% win rate increase with the release of Runic Echoes, Diana’s play rate still hovers at about 4%. The additional Movement Speed and burst damage from the Runic Echoes proc gives her huge snowball potential, and once Diana gets ahead, she eclipses the competition. With her fast and healthy clear she is able to get level 6 quickly and safely, at which point she has incredible ganks and dueling potential.

The thing that ~~shyvana ~~Diana does best in the jungle is farm. She is able to almost keep up with solo laners farm due to her near instant camp clearing. When you’re not ganking, you should be speed clearing your camps because this will give you a level edge versus the other jungler, and allow you to seek them out and duel them.

With this large farm advantage and her great dueling potential she has the potential to carry games unlike most other junglers. On the other hand, if she doesn't

Jungle Fiddlesticks - Mattias “Gentleman Gustaf” Lehman For me, League of Legends is all about outsmarting my opponent, whether it’s baiting somebody into a duel I know they can’t win, arriving just in time to turn a gank into a countergank, or dying to a four-man gank bot lane while my team sneaks baron. If you want to play mind games, nothing beats the feeling of surprising your opponent by flying over a wall and turning a bad teamfight into a perfect crowstorm. Fiddlesticks is the type of jungler that can put the game on his shoulders or throw the whole game for his team. But with great responsibility comes great power.

With exception of the Runeglaive days, Fiddlesticks has consistently maintained a high jungle win rate. Despite the Runic Echoes change, Fiddlesticks’ pick rate remains low, but his win rate is back to terrifying levels.

Watch out for knockbacks! Nothing feels worse than setting the perfect trap only to have it denied by a pesky Alistar.


Duskblade of Draktharr Of course, we’d be remiss if we didn’t touch on AD Assassins, who are getting a brand new item: Duskblade of Draktharr, giving them access to new burst and tank-busting ability.

Dusk has some serious pain points and counters, however. QSS and Zhonya’s both mitigate high amounts of damage against Dusk, just as they do vs Zed’s Death Mark, and assassins who itemize into Dusk should find their scaling falling off as they progress into the late game and find more and more of their damage mitigated by Zhonya’s, QSS, and growing shields coming from supports.

All AD assassins use Duskblade reasonably well, but the two biggest threats are Zed and Talon

Zed - Blake “Ex Shepherd” Soberanis I play Zed because killing other players is fun. Ult in, drop my damage, dash out, and walk away while my target dies to Death Mark like the badass ninja that I am. Zed is the end of the alphabet, and I am the end of your time on Summoner’s Rift. So watch out for Duskblade because now Death Mark comes twice.

Sure, Zed nerfs hit live at the same time Dusk does, but 5% less Death Mark damage isn’t going to stop me from killing you.

Zed benefits heavily from the Duskblade proc thanks to the damage amp on Death Mark. Either the Dusk proc will be amplified by Death Mark, or Death Mark will be amplified by Dusk proc. Either way, he ends up gaining more damage from the Duskblade proc than any other champions. Minor nerfs will be following him onto live as a result, but players who time their use of Duskblade well should be able to account for this.

Talon - Ben "Cezium" Burkhardt Don’t forget about Talon, though. With a 53%+ win rate over the last 3 patches, the release of Duskblade is almost secondary to his consistency, but nobody ever complained about too many good things.

His laning phase is weak, but Corrupting Flask allows him to sustain through the early game and pick up the items he needs to pick off squishy carries and supports.

Honorable Mention Jungle Gragas - Scott "Sickoscott" Hong Gragas' early clear was a big reason as to why he hasn't been picked lately. With the 6.3 buffs he may make it back into viability and find a place in both solo and competitive.

What do you think? Who are your sleepers for 6.3? Tell us below in the comments and feel free to ask any questions you have for Playtest Team at Riot, whether they be about balance or what exactly our job is! We will be around for the next few hours and will try to answer as many questions as possible.

Ben “Cezium” Burkhardt Adam "Afic" Cohen Isaac “Azael” Cummings-Bentley Shawn “I Am The IRS” Currie Miles “Daydreamin” Hoard Scott “Sickoscott” Hong Mattias “Gentleman Gustaf” Lehman Nicholas “Drecker” Shapiro Nicholas “Nickwu” Smith Blake “Ex Shepherd” Soberanis Trevor “ThEntropist” Thernes

746 Comments

KishinB67 votes

I enjoy my Xin top lane so much, start and max Q then E for the cooldown reduction(I guess W now as of this patch lol). Play like an AD assassin and just destroy squishies one by one. You can 1v1 most meta tops at level 1 because of the Q's AA reset and enhanced damage. And if a cheeky jungler tries to gank, ult him away and escape.

But now... Win Zhao is getting W crits??? XinZhao ??? Time to go off-tank top lane and...

BE A MAN YOU MUST BE SWIFT AS A COURSING RIVER WITH ALL THE FORCE OF A GREAT TYPHOON WITH ALL THE STRENGTH OF A RAGING summoner 14 MYSTERIOUS AS THE DARK SIDE OF THE Diana

RiotSkarnye West43 votes

This guy's got us scared to death!Shyvana

RiotJordash37 votes

Hope he doesn't see right through me... item 3348

Smurfaded33 votes

Now I only wish that I knew how to swim!Nami

Bea1Rhyme14 votes

Be a Man! Braum

Dufsa4 votes

You must be swift as a coursing riverFizz

Bârd10 votes

With all the force of a great typhoon item 3085

Zidaryn29 votes

Up vote just for the Mulan song. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlzPY5NyEU4

Szechjuani19 votes

Thought he said "YOU MUST BE AS SWIFT AS A COURSING RIVEN"Riven

Señor Boy39 votes

wheres my nautilus VU i want that fucker HUGE! like TURRET HUGE. so huge that nautilus instantly kills dragon because it crashes into nautilus from flying into the map.

PrometheS35 votes

I understand the nerf to Zed in this case but there is a problem with nerfing champions based on items. For example, in Zed's case, the nerf means that you now HAVE to build Duskblade or you're just in a worse spot than before. Nerfing a champion due to a new item that's supposed to be strong on them enforces a certain build path.

There is no AP Zed or tank Zed so it's not that much of an issue for him but for other champions it certainly could be. For example, I plan on trying it with Nocturne but I'd hate to have him nerfed because of it since I play him in many styles. Sometimes I go Cinderhulk into tank, other times Devourer into bruiser, sometimes Devourer into all damage items, occasionally full AD assassin with Warrior etc. I love this flexibility but if an item is overwhelmingly strong on a champion, it just narrows their viable build paths by forcing that core since the champion is balanced around that particular item. Are you guys concerned about this at all?

DebonairCorgi28 votes

I feel like so much focus is being put onto AD champions in these last few patches. They are continuing to get better buffs and items, while mages continue to become easier to deal with. I main mages such as: Ahri, Karma, and Morgana, and continue to be forced to rush inefficiently priced items like Zonya's vs AD champions. You nerfed Mages a few patches ago by increasing the price of most of our strong items while leaving AD items virtually untouched. Mages have 3 items that have Magic Penetration and 1 Item (Abyssal) that lowers MR at close range... Then we have only 2 items that viably mitigate AD damage through Armor (Zonya's then Harbingers which isn't actually viable on mid-lane mages) and 4 items that provide Health, and 1 that provides a shield. Are you expecting us to change our builds to compensate for the explosive damage you're piling onto AD champions? Yes, we're bursty as hell, but you're making AD champions so bursty, buying Zonya's is a complete waste because we have to burn it EVERY time it's up only to be melted right after because AD champs have 5 items (all of which are viable on virtually any AD champion) that provide Armor Pen, and can be stacked (Ex: Maw + Ghostblade), Now duskblade so 6, 2 items that are again highly viable on virtually all AD Champs and provide MR, and 5 items that provide strong health options. All of these items are viable picks for most AD Champions WITHOUT disrupting their builds, whereas Mages have very few that are also easy to work against. Unless we ditch our normal build path and build defensive items galore, we're easily bursted down.

It's very hard for mages that are behind to get back into the game vs AD Champions now, whereas many AD champions just need to buy one or two items to get back in if they have a rough early game.

I might just be bad at League or just inexperienced, but to me it seems like all the focus is leaning too heavily towards AD Champions, making Mages weaker.

FrostCloud5 votes

I just wanna know why riot never replies to comments like these. But always comment on people just saying stupid things like the nasus comment below when he can easily just look up builds.

MrWasjig2 votes

Because they have no excuse that's why. They clearly hate AP champions and favour AD but whenever somebody brings that up with a perfectly valid argument and reasoning (Like DorkCorgi here), they have no excuses and thus ignore them.

Riot says they don't play favourites? Yeah just sign here for this ship of bullshit.

RiotJordash8 votes

I mean, there's a big ol' Mage rework on the books for later this year - I don't know how that factors into the belief that everyone hates AP but hey.

Nefas11 votes

Why would that be a help? The last time Riot looked at Mages (Mage item reworked) all the prices got nerfed to hell while abominations like Maw are created offering AD, MR, MR shield, and AR Pen.

Zhonyas feels terrible to rush. Adding another cloth armor to Seekers won't fix that when Riot has added so many armor pen options everywhere that do feel good for assassins to rush against mages, like Maw.

RiotJordash3 votes

Alrighty, let's see what we have here.

True, a lot of AP items have become pretty rough to buy early on. Personally, I hope to see some cost adjustments similar to what recently happened to Morello's vs FQC. Even with the cost increases, though, the terror that was FQC was a really interesting meta in my opinion and serves to highlight a lot of the differences with AP vs AD itemization. The way I see it, AD is (typically) about stats first, actives second whereas AP items focus on either heavy utility for their cost or significant power-boosts in stats (massive CDR, for one). I'm kind of rambling, but this is how I see things.

For a vast majority of cases, AP burst will win out over AD, that's just the nature of the class of champion. AD Assassins being heavily bursty would feel awful if they could be countered without adjusting one's buildpath at all - League is a super dynamic games that for the mostpart requires you to play every game at least a little differently in regards to itemization, and this is just at a super low baseline of variance.

If you're burning Zhonya's every time it's up in fights, that's kind of what it's there for, no? Using Zhonya's to save yourself is why you buy it, and why you -should- be buying it. Similar to how AD's have something like Mercurial available, Zhonya's simply becomes a borderline necessity at some point if the gamestate requires it. You wouldn't skip out on a QSS / Mercurial against a hard-CC or massively impactful debuff oriented team (Malzahar, Zed, Warwick etc); Zhonya's is, in a way, an equivalent case to it, no? I don't think League would be anywhere near as fun or interesting if you could pick a Mage, heck, any champion and build the exact same thing every game while expecting the exact same results to come through. Granted there are exceptions and some champions can get by mostly by doing this, but it's in the minority.

Duskblade also isn't super viable on every AD champion, at least not early. It's REALLY strong on certain things like Zed, Talon or Rengar, but a lot of other champions simply can't find a way to fit it into early(ish) builds or justify it over something like an earlier Ghostblade, BT, IE etc. It's a good item, but it's a lot more niche than you might think. Of course, this was just my opinion through initial testing and I may turn out to be totally wrong.

tl;dr I don't really feel that AP is in as bad a spot as it's being made out to be, but I do agree that things like item costs need to have another look at them. Hopefully at the very least with the Mage update, you'll start feeling a lot better about the place they're in.

Hellioning6 votes

My big complaint, on AD vs. AP, is that Hexdrinker is a much better item then Armguard. If Armguard had a mini-Zhonya's, that'd be cool, but right now I'd rather be facing an AP champ with a Hexdrinker than facing an AD champ with an armguard.

(Also: AP champs have mana costs. Every gold spent on Armguard or Zhonya's is gold not spent on easing the mana burden. Zed (and to a lesser extent Talon) don't care about that.)

Vekkna26 votes

Zed Second highest pick rate in mid Talon Second highest win rate in mid

"Sleeper"

Ok.

RiotJordash5 votes

Even with that win rate, Talon's at ~4% pick rate. Thankfully, a majority of players are sleeping on him!

(Talon scares me ;____;)

Vekkna9 votes

In all seriousness, it strikes me as being excruciatingly obvious that AD assassins (Zed, Talon, etc) and fighters (Fiora, Wukong, etc) are going to be completely broken with Duskblade. Most are already sitting well above average for win rates, but Riot keeps pulling a Rubio-bot with this line about how hard AD assassins were hit by the Last Whisper change.

From playtesting, is Duskblade breaking AD champs as much as it looks like it would? If not, why?

EDIT: Plus, my original concern with Duskblade giving every AD assassin/fighter an execute is that it gives them a huge tool to play from behind when they're designed to snowball or be shut down.

RiotRiot Afic13 votes

The thing about duskblade is that the optimal use case is very clear and powerful. In practice, what we saw in a lot of our games is that the controlling the proc to go off only when you want it happens less frequently than you might think.

First, it has a 2 minute cooldown. That is actually an extremely long time. If you want to make sure you are able to utilize the proc to its fullest, that means that you CAN'T auto attack the enemy unless you are ready to all in them.

Second, it goes off after 2 seconds. For most champions that is plenty of time to do a large chunk of your damage, but for some of the more sustain damage type champions, the proc will go off way too early and will tickle more than it would execute.

Overall it is definitely a strong item with a LOT of potential, but between it's long cooldown and connection to triggering off of ANY auto attack, it hopefully won't be as oppressive as you might otherwise think.

Lvl 6 Jigglypuff24 votes

I play a lot of immobile mage mid laners (Anivia , Lux , etc) and as such I have a completely unbiased burning hatred of slight bias against AD assassins since they tend to do well against that type of mid laner, so take everything I say with a grain of salt.

But it seems like mid lane AD champs, namely assassins, have been pretty strong all season due partially to item and mastery changes. While mages have to rush CDR/mana and have little mobiilty, they rush damage, apply tons of lane pressure, and can then roam and impact the map far more effectively. As such, what was the reasoning for this new item? I like it, it seems really cool don't get me wrong, but I don't see why they need another strong toy to play with.

They already kill squishies well (which is their job, and a very important part of the game), and tanks are usually the rock-paper-scissors counter to them. This item seems to make them even better at killing squishies and, as the very article says, help with tank busting. From what you all say it seems to not break the game, and I highly doubt it will 'broken', but surely my concerns aren't unfounded. Does this item really not make AD assassins that much stronger, because on paper it seems to. And just a tiny bit more power early is more than enough to snowball even harder on already snowbally champs

Rozark13 votes

I've always wondered what it would be like if AP mages had another -potentially core- armor item besides Zhonyas (No, Zeke's doesn't really count here even though it does have both AP and armor, that's more of a supporty item.) Having two -core- magic resist items (Athene's and Abyssal, to a lesser extent BoC) is nice (Despite Athenes being more part of the choice of Athenes vs Morellos) so I'm wondering why another armor option hasn't been implemented yet. It would certainly help with the increased popularity of assassins that's about to hit. I probably wouldn't mind assassins much myself if there was at least another armor option.

C9 Midian19 votes

If you play the hell out of this game, why is fiora not being nerfed?

Asyde19 votes

DRAGON'S DOMINANCE (4TH STACK) +15% damage to monsters and minions ⇒ You take 20% less damage from turrets

I can't even begin to tell you how terrible of an idea this is. Turrets already barely tickle at higher levels, hell turret diving at lower levels is practically a joke now. The LAST thing we need is for them to do LESS DAMAGE...

Riot please, If anything make it so that dragon buff INCREASES turret damage or INCREASES turret defenses.

Banısh17 votes

I feel like you left Phreak out of the list there... he obviously had some influence

RiotSkarnye West75 votes

I sat next to Phreak for a few weeks when I worked in esports. I'll never been the same again...

DatDingoChingo162 votes

Did he Phreak you out?

WarlordTim12 votes

take the upvote. take it.

Hypoetic15 votes

Just gonna come right out and say this... STOP FIXING THINGS THAT AREN'T BROKEN! alistar was perfectly fine and now ur making him easier to play? how about we get auto insect plays from leesin? i mean common i should only have to think about do i want to land this combo or am i going to land this combo...

what about riven? think we can get some auto animation cancelling for the AAs after Q? or maybe some ERQaaW2aaQRQ combos i mean not even the pros get the full riven combo correctly every time better make it accessible to everyone who hasn't practiced enough to master it.

i have an even crazier idea... lets may thresh auto flay leonas E engage i mean who needs timing AMIRIGHT...

but heres the best part... STOP TRYING TO FIX THINGS THAT ARENT BROKEN

GEE thanks!

nubblez11 votes

What are you guys' thoughts on AD Brand Brand ? I love this hero and been experimenting with him ever since the dark horse article to have him as support. I think he really brings a lot to the table as an ADC in terms of raw mixed damage like Corki, with the added benefit of a stun! The stun really does wonders for winning trades and self peel.

Iife12 votes

Annie juse seems better than Brand for that. Better range, more reliable stun, Tibbers to micro to tank for you, and flame shield for some resists.

RiotSkarnye West29 votes

AD Annie vs AD Brand, who wins?

I can't be the only one who wants to see you two 1v1 :D

Summonerrr 111 votes

I feel like with these last few patches and the changes to the raw numbers especially of the past few seasons, you guys (intentionally or not, doesn't matter to me) are moving away from towers being a credible mid-late game threat to champions and dives, and more towards a trivial objective necessary to victory. Is this an accurate feeling? I may be overreacting here, but it just seems like towers go down 2-3x faster than they used to.

I'm also unsure as to why Crest of Cinders (Red buff) works on towers when the latest dragon buff changes make it to where that would be essentially redundant.

in season 3-5 taking 2 or more tower shots for a dive, after 13-15 minutes was still a very serious gambit. Now with the itemization changes and damage changes in regard to how durable turrets are in particular, they seem more like static non-threatening objectives necessary to victory than a REAL threat or credible point to form a defense around. I often see matches where certain tanks would routinely take 4-5 shots and even without half their build done, it still hardly phases them, often not even taking 33-50% of their health.

This wouldn't be as much of an issue for me, but when a tower can be taken down right after laning phase is over by 1-3 champions with a single minion wave, they just kind of seem like a joke.

Northerner8 votes

shhhh ... dont tell everyone about nautilus .... let him stay at the bottom of the sea where only I can play him ...

Rabid R68 votes

I'd like to know what kind of backwards thinking snake got this xin update through the cracks honestly. we just got murdered by him 4 people on him. he had devourer and guinsoos. and we couldn't kill him. honestly riot. what are you doing to this game? sincerely someone recognizing its getting worse as the days go on.

SignError6 votes

Illaoi

How do you feel about Support Illaoi? I've seen a lot of her recently.

RiotSkarnye West20 votes

Somebody played that in a game I was in and I thought they were trolling. Fast forward 20 minutes and the support Illaoi was the only positive player on the team other than me, and we ended up carrying hard. Never underestimating that again!

Still not sure if it's...good. But anything can be good if the person playing it knows what they're doing

dude68killermax5 votes

Nasus top is actually so strong if you play him right you can dominate lane. even if you get killed early on just get stacks and come back top. with that being sad i don't know what items exactly to build past frozen heart so if any one can tell me that would be great thx

RiotSkarnye West8 votes

Spirit Visage synergizes stupidly well with his passive, and Sheen is stronger on him than ever thanks to the CDR it gives this season!

At that point, Dead Man's Plate makes it harder to kite you and you can go full defensive items from there!

SorenWestwood5 votes

Interesting thread, appreciated the info

slightly OT, but I noticed Drecker was on staff. That the earth spirit player? Wouldn't be surprised he ended up on this team.

RiotJordash18 votes

I am indeed the dirty, dirty Earth Spirit picker. Thanks for calling out my grime!

Yay DotA!

[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

OllyTrolly11 votes

Wot?

RiotJordash3 votes

When I was playing serious / competitive DotA, I became known for my Earth Spirit play (at least in pubs because he was rarely if ever allowed in competitive play). Earth Spirit is typically seen as a super dirty pick because he does pretty much everything extremely well, and has seen more nerfs than basically anything in any game ever while still remaining strong.

Merxamers2 votes

As someone who has played both games, what aspects/philosophies of DOTA2 would you like to see reflected more in LoL? What negatives would you like to see LoL avoid?

RiotJordash12 votes

This is an extremely broad question that I've literally had 4-5+ hour conversations regarding without even scratching the surface, but I'll try to give some bulletpoints. Both games do a lot of really cool and unique things, and with the level of mechanical differences it gives so much variety, I'm really glad to have played both as much as I have.

These are all my personal opinions, please do not misconstrue this as what Riot dislikes about League or features to come, etc.

What I'd like to see, ie where the biggest gains could possibly fall:

  • More meaningful decisions regarding mana usage - League feels kind of spam-happy at times; trying to explain the concept of CS'ing with your abilities on a LOT of champions to DotA players is often met with head scratches or general confusion, since as you know DotA is much more punishing with mana costs. However, basic abilities tend to be overall more powerful in DotA (imagine something like Paralyzing Casks on a support in League), so there's also that.
  • More unique / interesting active items. Something like Force Staff is so cool! Ghost Scepter has really powerful risk/reward windows - it can make or break a lot of escapes. You're giving up potential boosts to your stats for these really powerful item effects and I just think that it opens up a lot of really fun design space. League has a lot of awesome passive items (things like RFC / Phantom Dancer come to mind), but it's a different space altogether.
  • Interaction with the map - champions like Bard, Graves, Nautilus and Poppy showcase this in awesome ways, but since most of the jungle / tree terrain can be destroyed in DotA, it just opens the door for so much. If you're familiar with Heroes of Newerth, Silhouette had an ability where she was able to grapple a tree and literally rip it out by the roots as a missile towards her, stunning everything in its path.
  • The chat-wheel system is fantastic - being able to call out "Stun!" "Go Go!" "Ultimate ready in X seconds!" enables a lot of playmaking opportunities and helps general communication quite a bit.

What I think LoL does extremely well, in comparison

  • Jungle accessibility. The jungle, to me, is the most unique and incredibly well-done facet of Summoner's Rift - it defines a class of champion entirely, opens up so many meta possibilities, allows a lot more around-the-map action... the way it's been implemented in our game just makes me so happy, as a long time DotA player. Jungling can be awkward and clunky at times in DotA, taking advantage of things like proper pulling / camp stacking, it's a lot to keep track of to optimize (look at Merlini's old jungle Beastmaster stuff, it's pretty nuts).

  • Support gold generation. Playing a true hard-5 support in DotA can be incredibly punishing, to the point that you're level 4-5 when others on the map are at times triple your level and you're literally being oneshot. Boots being the only thing you're able to buy in a game can feel awful, so the way League approaches supports is definitely a breath of fresh air. I started competitive DotA as a hard-5 support main (moved to mid lane or occasionally offlane 3 play), so while I really understand and enjoy the playstyle, I get why it's not fun for some.

  • Passive ability slot. Honestly one of my favorite things about League, the passive slot is champion defining in a lot of ways, and while some can feel underwhelming, others are just so cool that you play your whole game around them. It adds another level of character diversity to the game. DotA has a lot of passive abilities that just aren't fun to level up to a lot of players, but League can avoid this kind of thing because -everyone- has a passive!

  • Alternative stats, instead of base attributes (STR/AGI/INT). I think in a lot of ways, League's stat system is a lot cleaner than it is in DotA. Where DotA has a throwback to the (limitations) of the WC3 engine in the three-stat system, League has a bunch of unique stats that open the door for a much different buildpath for lots of characters. Things like cooldown reduction (which DotA has forms of now), penetration, general resists and flat HP/mana values instead of having to quickmath makes League's stat system in some ways a lot more intuitive to some players. Readability is big, and I think it's handled extremely well in League.

Again, there are my personal opinions! I can go on for days, but these are what popped in my head initially!

Merxamers4 votes

I feel like Zilean mid is pretty sleeper OP. Playing against it can be frustrating, even if i'm not mid; he just speeds up teammates and slows you down.

I may actually try to go Nautilus top, but i don't know what masteries/runes to take; i feel like i'd do no damage to whoever else went up there.

GitExcited4 votes

Is Graves getting a nerf any time soon? [slayer-jinx-unamused]

Bodkins Odds26 votes

He's nerfed in 6.3. Do you not read patchnotes? [zombie-brand-facepalm]

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