General Changes to Objectives for Mid-season

RiotRiot GMang·4/19/2016, 8:55:21 PM·1 votes·75,737 views

Hey everybody,

Hopefully you’ve had the chance to check out our Dragon and Mage changes for mid-season. We’ve got a bunch of other objective changes to Summoner’s Rift going in the patch, and I wanted to share those + context with ya’ll and take your questions and feedback!

Everything is subject to tuning and future iteration, of course.

Rift Herald We’re pushing to make Rift Herald a more unique and meaningful objective for those looking to dominate the top half of the map. This new Rift Herald should be a more contestable objective with a clearer purpose: long-term selfish power for one team member - especially a lone-wolf or split push character.

  • Rift Herald now spawns at 6 minutes and never respawns
  • Rift Herald’s stats significantly increased (should be much harder to solo)
  • Doom’s Eve removed and replaced with a unique Superbuff:
  • Lasts 20 minutes and persists through death
  • While alone, you gain some damage reduced vs. champions and build Corruption stacks
  • At 100 stacks, your next attack discharges all Corruption to deal bonus magic damage (works on almost anything, including minions and towers; damage is reduced for ranged attacks)
  • Corruption stack rate and discharge damage scale with champion level

Hopefully this excites top laners, junglers, and some mids. We’re keeping an eye on it to ensure it’s powerful, but also contestable and not too game-ending.

Red and Blue Buffs

Late-game, Red and Blue buff have been somewhat ignorable these days. We’re buffing and compressing their power in the mid-late game to make them more appreciable objectives to leverage or steal, especially in games that are in a standstill and need things to fight over and create power windows.

  • Red Buff
  • Burn now applies a damage tick immediately on apply or reapply (stronger attack-speed scaling); damage-per-tick reduced to compensate
  • Health regen now scales steeply with champ level but turns off when in combat with champions or epic monsters (currently triples at level 6 and again at level 11!)
  • Blue Buff
  • AP per level replaced with +15% total Ability Power (like Rabadon’s Deathcap effect)
  • Mana regen based on max Mana doubled (flat regen unchanged)
  • Buff Durations
  • Red and Blue will last the same duration on your first clear, but all Red and Blue buffs after that will have a 90-second duration instead of 120

When you’re looking to make a play in mid-late game, buff camps should be juicier targets now, especially if you can steal them from the enemy’s side of the map!

Camp Respawn Timers

In order to facilitate more coordinated and contested objective play at all skill levels, we’re making a some UI changes. This also has the benefit of reducing timekeeping and chat-typing work.

  • When a camp that has a timer (Red, Blue, Dragon, Baron, Rift Herald) has less than 60 seconds to spawn, its timer is revealed to both teams at that time (regardless of their vision of the camp), and an “about to spawn” icon appears in the minimap simultaneously (will replace regular camp icon if you still haven’t seen the cleared camp by the time its respawn has 60 seconds left)
  • To clarify, if you never have vision of enemy jungle, you won't see any changes for the first 4 minutes after their camp dies. But at 60 seconds remaining to respawn, you will get new information over live.
  • The respawn icon starts dull at 60 seconds to spawn and becomes bright at 20 seconds

We generally like seeing more fights around objectives, and promoting objective awareness like this can help a lot. After getting used to the new UI, rallying your team around a Dragon spawn or even a buff steal can often be done with a simple ping instead of having to type things out in chat.

Turrets

Turrets have several changes in store. Overall, we want them to be more defendable places to stand your ground, reduce their takedown reward compared to other objectives, clean up some of their mechanics, and rebudget their defenses so things other than marksmen basic attacks can contribute more to turret takedowns.

  • Turret Damage Ramp
  • Inner and Outer turrets more quickly ramp up their damage when attacking champions, and they maintain full damage when switching targets.
  • Inner and Outer turrets only take 4 shots to ramp up to full damage (instead of 5).
  • Turret Takedown Rewards
  • Outer turret total gold reward reduced, though local gold reward is increased (local gold 220 -> 300, global gold 125 -> 100)
  • Inner turret gold rewards reduced (local gold 250 -> 175, global gold 150 -> 125) and XP reward removed
  • Inhibitor turret local gold reward increased (0 -> 50)
  • AP Damage Conversion
  • When your attacks trigger AP damage conversion (occurs when attacking a turret while your AP is more than double your bonus AD), the converted damage is now magic instead of physical
  • Turret Stats
  • Base Armor/MR increased (from 0 to 40), Base Health decreased (from 4000 to 3300)
  • Turrets are now subject to penetration (generally tankier than Live unless you have about 20 penetration or have a true damage proc; overall a small nerf to marksmen damage, but a buff to some mages and assassins)
  • Reinforced Armor converted from 200 Armor/MR to 66.67% damage reduction

Overall, diving and taking turrets should be less of a freebie than what we’ve seen recently.

Let’s hear your thoughts!

257 Comments

warpenguin5554/19/2016, 9:06:07 PM49 votes

Im going to have to say no to that herald change. that looks to be flat out broken. Instead of it lasting 20 minutes and through death, do you think that maybe killing the buff holder could instead reduce its duration by a few minutes? The way you guys are currently pitching it makes it look like if the enemy top laner gets that buff you automatically lose lane, which is not fun gameplay

hopeful44/19/2016, 9:58:33 PM28 votes

Why in gods name you keep giving tons of free information to the enemy team for literally doing nothing? Yes im talking about the new timers. You realize how much less meaningful you are doing vision control in your jungle and enemy jungle?

Hellioning4/19/2016, 9:04:40 PM15 votes

Yes, this is exactly what I want. More reasons for my top laner to pretend the rest of the map doesn't exist.

Also: Are you supposed to get the timer for blue/red buff when you didn't see it die originally? Because on the PBE, that is currently the case on PBE and it is dumb.

doing ok4/19/2016, 10:07:01 PM14 votes

I gotta say that I really don't like the auto timers. For example, let's say I'm consistently shutting down their vision by taking scuttler, killing their jg, killing wards etc. And then they know when my red spawns anyway, and invade me with their dynamic q buddies while the strangers on my team don't help me :^). I feel like this rewards less skilled players...(not that i'm very good but just sayin)

SquirrellyOtter4/19/2016, 9:18:12 PM8 votes

Would the jungle timer UI changes reward teams that don't ward as well as they should, considering they will be able to coordinate an invade for a buff steal and possible a kill basically for free, given the new "about to spawn" icons and global timers on sided buffs?

Pimpinabox4/19/2016, 11:16:49 PM8 votes

Honestly, I'm not sure I want to play this version of league.

Edit: And I've been here a very long time.

Stags4/19/2016, 10:52:24 PM5 votes

Some of these changes look decent, but I'm very much not a fan of auto-timers on Red and Blue buff. They certainly made sense for Dragon and Baron: those are effectively "neutral" objectives seated between both teams. Red and Blue, however, are rooted deep in either teams' jungle. Essentially giving teams "free" information about those buffs spawning almost seems like it creates too many objectives to be managing and rotating to for an average team.

Already in lower ELO (and sometimes even in higher), you have players panic rush Dragon when contesting it isn't critical and treating every lost dragon, regardless of number, as the only win condition. I really don't want to deal with the # of people who are going to try to rush and steal the new red/blue, then tilt off the face of the planet if they lose it (or God forbid, their own).

20 Minutes on Herald buff is just ridiculously too much as well and frankly, I don't think it's going to accomplish much. Either it becomes an issue where it's so strong, people just wait until late game pre-Baron to kill it so it's less punishing (since its dmg has been buffed), or it's effectively "traded" between teams (Red Team goes Dragon, so Blue goes Herald and vice versa) early on.

I think we'll have to wait for some PBE testing to assess, but in their current incarnation I think a lot of these changes are just too strong. (That's not the worst thing for PBE though. It's easier to nerf something that's too powerful than buff something without making it OP.)

Cookieloots4/20/2016, 6:58:50 AM5 votes

You do realize that all that you are doing with global buff re-spawn timers is give the lazy snowballing teams more buffs right? I mean even in this iteration of the game on live, good players/teams that are already snowballing a game take the buffs anyways. Your only shot even now as a losing team is just to hope the team is too lazy or lacks awareness that the buff is up and maybe you get to sneak an occasional buff or 2 while losing. But now after you guys made the buffs have more impact and gave the snowballing team a dinner bell to all buff re-spawns it will just make it impossible to lock up a buff period for losing teams. Why don't u guys just give baron/dragon pit true vision for both teams while your at it to create more strategic impact?

Rimi4/19/2016, 9:22:22 PM3 votes

Can you explain the blue and red buff respawn timers more? Will it show on the map when the camps are taken too??? This really sounds like it's going to be a big deal..

HexaDecimel4/19/2016, 9:09:42 PM3 votes

With all the changes happening such as Zigg's satchel executing towers under 25% health, or Dragon buffs that increase damage to turrets I think that the towers will still feel a little weak. Especially with a wave of minions to take aggro they will probably still fall fairly quickly.

I like that tower diving will be a little harder but not impossible. But I am not sure the overall health should have been nerfed. I guess this will help with the early game and probably have a trickle down effect. Guess I will have to wait and see.