Boards›Dev Corner

Quick Gameplay Thoughts: August 1

RiotMeddler·8/1/2018, 3:42:47 PM·1 votes·98,021 views

Hi folks,

Usual Disclaimers

These posts will often contain talk about future work we're doing, or planning to do, that isn't yet guaranteed to ship. The nature of the work could change or, depending on what we discover, projects mentioned may get delayed or even stopped. If you'd like to see a Tweet whenever a new one of these posts goes up: https://twitter.com/RiotMeddler

More thoughts on damage later this week

We're doing some planning around where damage comes from in LoL at present as mentioned previously. Should have some further thoughts to share in more detail later this week. Things we're particularly looking at are:

  • Different systems damage is coming from (how much from kits, versus items, versus runes etc)
  • How much damage, from non kit sources in particular, is front loaded (burst versus sustain)
  • Which damage sources should/shouldn't stack together (non stacking unique passive on items for example)

For anyone that missed it also talked last week about how lack of tanks (defensive ones especially) being played can also contribute to damage being high (less champs to soak, more champs per team with high damage output). https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/2RzBfAcE-quick-gameplay-thoughts-july-27

Experimental Game Modes

As you've probably seen we're trying something new at the moment where we're putting out a somewhat rough prototype. Goal there is to get early feedback from you folks on what is/isn't working, help figure out whether a mode has the potential to be a permanent addition to LoL or not. Feedback on the mode (currently called Nexus Blitz), much appreciated. Would be particularly helpful to hear which of the elements that aren't like other game modes you do or don't enjoy. Also really interested to hear how your thoughts compare before playing it and after. Are there things that sounded good on paper that weren't fun in practice, or vice versa?

We'd also love to hear what sort of things you'd like to see tried if we do any further public prototypes like this. Depending on how this goes we might give it another shot with a different mode at some point.

Announcement post for Nexus Blitz for those that haven't seen it already:

https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/yKk22n3O-experimental-modes-nexus-blitz

Gold Funneling penalty in 8.15

We made a couple of adjustments to the gold funneling penalty on jungle items in 8.15. The first is having it also apply to Twisted Treeline, based particularly off feedback collected from the regions with higher rates of TT play (EUW, EUN, NA, BR, LAN). Let us know how that additon’s feeling for you if you play TT, we’re certainly open to adjusting it further if needs be.

The second change, which also affects SR, is having the penalty only apply when you’ve got the most CS on a team, rather than the most gold. That should remove a lot of cases where early kills result in junglers who aren’t being funneled get an early gold lead and therefore get inappropriately penalized. Feedback on that also much appreciated. In particular if you found the 8.14 approach really penalizing, would be great to hear whether this works better for you or whether it’s still feeling like you’re being penalized at times when playing normally.

http://ddragon.leagueoflegends.com/cdn/6.24.1/img/champion/Ziggs.png

260 Comments

atlıkarınca8/1/2018, 3:45:33 PM11 votes

Hi, meddler. How is the work on the Lissandra going? When can we see live server or PBE?

Mordepool8/1/2018, 4:41:14 PM11 votes

Damage is too High.

Tanks Being played has nothing to do with the above statement

KOGMIDONLY8/1/2018, 4:37:38 PM10 votes

Will there be any love on zac on ur tank buffs list? I’m sick of everyone including myself on reddit complaining about new zac being inferior to old Zac a year and a half onwards and I’m definitely sick of people undermining my ability to play zac in ranked without being called a troll pick and 4v6 from my laners for my choice of pick and I absolutely dislike the stale one dimensional build path that is tank in order to be somewhat viable in this current day and time. Zacs my beacon of hope, the blobby trail path I presume to follow in hopes for a return to his former gooey self. I think he needs to be loved, by more than his pre reworked followers but by the riot team themselves.

There’s a few suggestions on reddit for improvements ~ One suggested to bring back ratio on w as a quality of life improvement for off-role playstyle as it wont affect pro play but bring a build variation to his solo q.

Another suggested that zac had additional affects based on how many blobs have been picked up which buffs his overall kit and feeling but not break him such as every 10th blob picked up resets w CD immediately or every xth blob picked up increases base damage of q/w/e/r by x

A lot of suggestions of a reverted ultimate, which I also lean towards.

Reduce the range of his Q to melee, but hand stretches while it’s attached to his target allowing him to chase another target to get in meele range to apply the collision of the second part of his q. So the second q which also must be applied in melee range is a nerf to the effectiveness of executing the q cc for something like more damage elsewhere or for additional blobs drop maybe 2x drop to 4x blobs which would make zac feel tankier and make w feel more useful with the lower CD when the blobs are picked up and it will also help his clear speeds and encourage his skirmish and dueling. This would encourage different playstyles and make landing e more rewarding as it allows for a easy q interaction during the cc duration and also interacts with his passive healing and w CD and punishes missing the e more. (Which could balance his solo Q and pro play)

Salvor Hardın8/1/2018, 3:53:11 PM9 votes

Any thoughts about Nami?

It seems to me that with the nerf in the shields, much of her competition was removed, and at this moment (and long ago) Nami is god tier with 53%+ wr

https://i.gyazo.com/de02fbc4e00a59bdde2f022337a9835c.png

I would also like to know if the changes to the tanks will be this week or next week, if it's not too much trouble.

Spideraxe8/1/2018, 3:53:30 PM7 votes

Also any more concrete details on tank buffs?

Packun Flower8/1/2018, 3:46:25 PM7 votes

Hey Meddler. Can i ask what happened to the planned Annie buffs?

Zoli Ben8/1/2018, 3:50:04 PM7 votes

Hi Meddler! Is the roadmap eta next week or after it? Has it been decided by now that Akali is out on live?

Silver Sonance8/1/2018, 3:51:34 PM6 votes

Hey Meddler, do you guys think that the diversity in bot lane from midseason has been lost in pro play? Marksmen seem to be picked the majority of the time and I think this might be solidified with their items being buffed. Will there be any plans to keep it diverse or will stability be prioritized instead?

Thanks

BadgerDrool8/1/2018, 5:42:37 PM6 votes

Hey Meddler. Zoe is being talked about a bunch due to some clips involving multiple W uses. Do you have any thoughts on her high RNG case where she gets multiple spell thief procs in a fight?

My own analysis has been that her passive and W passive can add a lot of unexpected power which lets her win fights in a frustrating manner. (Enemy misreads situation because Zoe misses skillshots but has multiple strong shards on the ground I.E. qt's recent clip)

As I am, admittedly, on the "let's nerf zoe" train, I shall append some ideas for changes. Some ideas are mine and some I've read include:

  • Spell Thief shards could use an item pool based off level to gate better shards/spells until later in the game.
  • Using Spell Thief fizzles all shards in a radius around her. So she can't bank spells on the ground from minions.
  • Can't pick up new shards for 5-10 seconds after using spell thief.
  • Spell thief shards from minions grant blank spells that only activates her W without doing anything else.
  • Balloons show the spell inside to Zoe's enemies. Allowing them to attempt to deny her last hit on the balloon minion when it's an impactful spell.
  • Lower W passive damage but allow Zoe to charge a neutral W activation. More consistent access to W baseline means the damage can be reduced thus allowing the best case W passive damage to be lowered.
  • Last hitting a minion with a Balloon releases the Balloon as an object Zoe must auto once to release the spell. Add time to pick up by requiring her to interact with the Balloon first.
ROX Peanut8/1/2018, 4:52:26 PM5 votes

Any information about the amumu buffs?

Reverting the W nerfs in 7.8 for example or giving his E passive a better scaling into the later stages of the game?

Or maybe even buffing his Q CC duration which seems to be quite low(1 sec) compared to other CC abilities.

Wee Petal8/1/2018, 4:27:41 PM5 votes

Is Zyra's plants now drawing minion aggro an intended effect? As they never used to.

This was happening on the previous patch as well, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't happening on the patch before that.

Pench Boi8/1/2018, 6:10:50 PM5 votes

I remember Azir and Ryze had small reworks scheduled, and then they got iceboxed. Will they receive any changes in the near future?

Queš8/1/2018, 3:47:45 PM4 votes

Thoughts on Aatrox ?

Also thoughts on the fact that conqueror is pretty much least used rune in high elo(toplane) ?

Tyberius118/1/2018, 9:22:42 PM4 votes

Meddler please look at the tanks including Nautilus, Maokai and Trundle. Their solo lane sucks! And Hecarim and Zac for jungle PLEASE.

Spideraxe8/1/2018, 3:46:44 PM3 votes

Hey Meddler, can I ask for your thoughts on how you guys intend Nexus Blitz won't fall into irrelevancy like Dominion, will the game modes, Systems or balance team consistently update or balance it? Also can I ask for any updates on Lissandra passive?

AtaxiChaos8/1/2018, 4:33:08 PM3 votes

If Nexus Blitz were to fail as a permanent mode, despite its current positive feedback, would it still have the possibility of still being developed into an rgm?

Launchpad8/1/2018, 6:48:22 PM3 votes

Meddler!

Glad to see you man. I need some help here. I end up playing support more than any other role, and I have a huge issue that I think we both can see benefits from.

Your balance team has decided that in order to make the early bot lane poke more impactful for supports, that you have made the support items go from 350 to 400 gold.

We start with 500 gold, which leaves us with the only gameplay option of going with 2 pots, and NOTHING ELSE.

BUT! What about the option to go into lane playing for completely not poking? Or utilizing Morg's ability to heal off of her spells? Or Pyke's ability to heal out of sight? I don't want or need those potions often in those match ups.

I want to take a item 1004 faerie charm, or a item 1006 Rejuv bead. And this completely removes that high risk/ high reward option. But with a 50 gold increase, that's impossible now. You don't have pots, so you either dodge the skill shots, or you make yours count with more spells from my fairy charm. It's a fun way to play, and I don't want to see it accidentally removed because something else is oppressive.

TLDR: **I implore you to reconsider the pricing from 350>400, instead make it 375 gold, and we both get what we want. All supports can't buy another potion, making poke more impactful, but if you want to you could still opt for the beads or charms. **

Thanks for your time! Launchpad

Cosnirak8/1/2018, 9:10:56 PM3 votes

No matter how much you shuffle the damage around source wise, delay it slightly, or shift team comps... the damage will still be too high. I agree that all of those things are issues too, and I've seen where you've acknowledged damage might also simply be too high, but I'm still here to very strongly reiterate that point because I feel it's that important. I want to go back to enjoying playing League.

Lulu the Support8/3/2018, 3:20:07 PM2 votes

Hey Meddler,

Regarding the current situation of damage in League. I feel that the removal of the old runes system is the culprit and I would like to elaborate on that. Not only is it impossible to get the usual 12 armor and 6 mr along with 10% CDR at level one, but the new runes are heavily focused on increasing damage, and in most cases the worst kind of damage: burst damage. We live in a frustrating state of the game where everyone is trying to outburst the oponent as oposed to longer fights with more outplay opportunities. That is especially true in the early game, with vastly lower resistances. Remember windpeaker's blessing? It was a very interesting keystone mastery designed for enchanter supports that helped keep their adc alive without giving them huge insane shields. There are specific champions that for example relied on the lvl 1 CDR to get through the laning phase successfully (cough Riven cough), but this is just an example. The old system allowed players to pick runes that cattered to their own unique playstyles. Maybe some prefered to go full mana regen runes, or full MS. I personally quite enjoyed going CDR+AS as Kayle, something that is no longer possible and which made playing Kayle with my particular playstyle impossible (thus why I never play her anymore). Nowadays the runes offer very limiting options, usually if you want something, you have to give up on another specific thing. The old system was not only more versatile but focused more on strengthening the players in the early game and it wasn't all about increasing damage/burst damage.

I'd be interested to hear what you think about my two cents, but I won't blame you if you don't have time to answer. Have a nice day, Valentin.

TomiMan78/1/2018, 5:30:49 PM2 votes

Since supports are viewed as low income high impact role, would you guys willing to change this by allowing supports to get more gold by skill, BUT increasing the cost of their items? This could be a new way to show off a support skill in some way, so there could be a massive difference between a bad a mediocre and a good support, and that could reflect in how early they can get their items, or not. If a support plays well they are rewarded and will be able to get their item, if they dont play well they will fall behind.

Tips on income: reward for providing good vision(already proposed this giving gold if a ward placed by a sup spots an enemy. Ofc ther should be restrictions so cannot be abused) higher reward for clearing vision bring back bandit since only supports can buy it now maybe even increase the chances to get gold from items(reducing the dmg part on spelthiefs, the regen on targon, dunno for coin) etc.

Thoughts?

Inventive8/1/2018, 5:34:34 PM2 votes

Thoughts on some Champs haveing insane burst with Stormrazor, Drakthar and Stattiks, while still having decent AD and Attackspeed?

La Bello8/1/2018, 9:37:11 PM2 votes

Hey Meddler Something I've wondered for a long time is.

Do you actually read through these entire threads page by page poring over every single comment? or do you just kinda AMA the first come first serve questions then not look back at all and go back to work/regular life stuff?

not trying to throw shade or anything just legitimately interested because I notice what happens is that the first 15 or so questions get a response then as like 90+ more questions pour in there is just radio silence for the next few days until the next "gameplay thoughts" come in.

Its always confused me how like if one just leisurely had free time during lunch/off work could you not come back and answer more of these to put some more worried or curious players at ease. are you only allowed to post during office hours or something? Is there a set amount of post you are allowed to make?

its just really weird and I would to know rather or not I should bother typing up post or responses in a these threads after the initial 6~24 hours passes