Boards›Dev Corner

Patch Chat 6.8 - Playtesting The Outrageous

RiotSkarnye West·4/19/2016, 7:41:48 PM·1 votes·113,242 views

Hey all,

Welcome back to Patch Chat! We’re Riot’s Playtest Team, a group of high ranking League players whose job it is to play the hell out of things (lane tests, competitive testing, etc) and give actionable, objective feedback to designers.

Every two weeks (concurrent with the release of patch notes), we’re going to be hosting a discussion here on the state of balance on the current patch. Take this opportunity to ask us any questions about the state of the game.

Taric drops soon, so feel free to ask us any questions about the process of playtesting a rework.

As well, we’ve given our thoughts on sustain, given the Patch 6.8 sustain changes.

If you looked deep in the patch notes, you saw a series of related changes to lane sustain, aimed at allowing mistakes in lane to be punished, and forcing hard-scaling champions to actually work to make it into the late game. As players, how did we feel about those changes?

I don’t really mind high sustain. It pushes a different subset of champions to the forefront of top lane and gives me a new play experience. -- Ben “Cezium” Burkhardt

Sustain in lane makes me feel like I can have a second chance, and makes lane more interesting by allowing for more fights. However, the current level of sustain - especially combined with Teleport - makes your accomplishments in lane feel useless/nullifies lane phase. -- Shawn “I Am The IRS” Currie

I already play high sustain champions in lane, like Cho’Gath or Nasus. I like the ways those champions can consistently weather the storm and come out on top. High sustain metas frustrate me, because if everybody can do that, so why am I playing those champions? -- Mattias “_Gentleman Gustaf” Lehman

High lane sustain allows bad players to make it through the early laning phase. The laning phase is what I find the most fun to play around because it is where you can show your individual skill. -- Trevor “ThEntropist” Thernes

I don’t mind playing with high sustain. I like to stay in lane to cs or fight the enemy laner. If passive sustain gets too high, then top lane only feels OK if you’re both champions that benefits from it. With Corrupting Flask, if your enemy laner takes it, you probably should too. I’ll be happy if I end up being able to start Doran’s Blade on more champions through top lane. -- Nicholas “Nickwu” Smith

**Taric - From Gem Knight to Shield of Valoran ** As playtesters, our job is to represent players at Riot; to make sure the in-game experience is protected from patch to patch. Nowhere is that more clear than in champion reworks, where we have to make sure that the new and improved kits feel improved and yet still the same.

With Taric, that struggle was pretty strong, as we all remembered playing Taric in the past. When we think of Taric, the key ideas that came to mind were his simplicity, and the bucket of stats he gave his team. Once we got over the more complicated kit of Taric, we grew pretty attached to the protective nature of his kit.

We especially learned to enjoy playing around his passive. If you’re ahead, and get to stagger your abilities and make optimal use of your passive, Taric can be quite aggressive and know that he will always have an ability up to bail out a teammate -- or himself. On the other hand, If you’re behind, and don’t get to use your passive consistently, Taric has to choose his actions more carefully, and rely on high-impact reactive casts.

Moreover, thanks to the use unusual targeting (your Bastion conduit), we got to really feel growing mastery of this champion over time, hitting a clutch stun or ultimate based on the positioning of an ally. There are certainly some frustration points (sometimes your allies just don’t move the way you’d expect them to, but playing Taric teaches you to be pretty good at reading your allies’ movements, not just your enemies.

Of course, Taric did have to give some things up, including his explosive burst combo and his simplicity, but getting to explore the deep mastery curve of new Taric more than made up for it in our opinion.

What do you think of the Taric rework or sustain changes? Have any questions about what it’s like to work as a Riot playtester? Maybe some questions about 6.8 as a whole? As usual, feel free to ask any questions about balance or what exactly our job is! We will be around for the next few hours and will try to answer as many questions as possible.

Adam "Afic" Cohen Ben “Cezium” Burkhardt Shawn “I Am The IRS” Currie Miles “Daydreamin” Hoard Mattias “Gentleman Gustaf” Lehman Nicholas “Nickwu” Smith Blake “Ex Shepherd” Soberanis Trevor “ThEntropist” Thernes

231 Comments

Igglet4/19/2016, 7:50:00 PM14 votes

I feel like one change causes another one. Mordekaiser works really well with new Taric, as Taric has the means to allow Mord to get close to the enemy and wreck their asses. And, his shield works really well with bruisers, better than with ADCs. Plus, with the addition of the new dragons in 6.9, I think Mordekaiser ADC will be back in the meta again, which will indirectly buff Kindred jungle, as that way you'll still have a Marksman in your team, just not on the bot lane. Maybe I'm going too far with this, but, what do you guys at Riot think?

9kPluzZ4/19/2016, 8:21:49 PM7 votes

Given the lore/model changes, do you feel that Taric still fits the "support" role?

Do you expect him to be viable/abused in the top/jg?

RandomD3Mon4/20/2016, 7:44:48 AM5 votes

A little question does the new Brand passive stacks on minions and monster? And if yes will he be any good jungle?

warpenguin5554/19/2016, 9:25:43 PM4 votes

Are you guys currently play testing any unreleased champions?

Josepheous4/19/2016, 11:47:22 PM4 votes

What does your day as a Riot playtester look like?

Kinox4/20/2016, 1:11:54 AM4 votes

R.I.P Ekko Thx riot for nerfing another good hero to 0, 2 more years of LCS 1 pro win with 1 hero the next patch he is nerfed...........bb Gauntlet!!!Ekko [slayer-jinx-unamused] item 3025 summoner 3

Carnicore4/19/2016, 8:44:16 PM3 votes

Have you found any use for Ohmwrecker?

Kei1434/19/2016, 8:38:26 PM3 votes

tell us. the feeling / story when you guys saw pink taric's skin / splash for the first time.

Also, I'm guessing you guys have been testing the new mages for a while now. interesting things you can share?

Finally, the new mage items. How does the "More mana for mages, more regen for supports" feel?

JRobin314/19/2016, 9:48:15 PM3 votes

I think that RIP Taric. I know RIOT makes an effort for reworked champions to feel like the old versions, but ultimately what it comes down to is that RIOT doesn't like a champion's kit so much that they decide to remove it from the game rather than balance it and no matter what you replace it with, that champion will never feel like it did. It will inevitably feel like a new champion that has the same name as the old champion. So I think to embrace the new Taric you have to let go of the old Taric.

"As playtesters, our job is to represent players at Riot; to make sure the in-game experience is protected from patch to patch." "With Taric, that struggle was pretty strong, as we all remembered playing Taric in the past. "

I'm not saying this is a bad thing or a good thing but RIP Taric.

SgtSpartacus874/19/2016, 9:12:11 PM3 votes

I feel with Taric's new Ult giving you basically an A.O.E. Kayle ult that can save a whole team, that Kayle's iconic invulnerability might just be a bit outclassed. Any thoughts about changes to her R to help keep it viable?

RivenNoLastName4/19/2016, 9:08:58 PM2 votes

So, does the new tibbers do more damage?

ALthaGreat4/20/2016, 8:26:50 AM1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Gentleman Gustaf,realm=NA,application-id=A7LBtoKc,discussion-id=ZEN5MP0w,comment-id=,timestamp=2016-04-19T19:41:48.123+0000)

Hey all,

Welcome back to Patch Chat! We’re Riot’s Playtest Team, a group of high ranking League players whose job it is to play the hell out of things (lane tests, competitive testing, etc) and give actionable, objective feedback to designers.

Every two weeks (concurrent with the release of patch notes), we’re going to be hosting a discussion here on the state of balance on the current patch. Take this opportunity to ask us any questions about the state of the game.

Taric drops soon, so feel free to ask us any questions about the process of playtesting a rework.

As well, we’ve given our thoughts on sustain, given the Patch 6.8 sustain changes.

If you looked deep in the patch notes, you saw a series of related changes to lane sustain, aimed at allowing mistakes in lane to be punished, and forcing hard-scaling champions to actually work to make it into the late game. As players, how did we feel about those changes? -- Ben “Cezium” Burkhardt -- Shawn “I Am The IRS” Currie -- Mattias “_Gentleman Gustaf” Lehman -- Trevor “ThEntropist” Thernes -- Nicholas “Nickwu” Smith

**Taric - From Gem Knight to Shield of Valoran ** As playtesters, our job is to represent players at Riot; to make sure the in-game experience is protected from patch to patch. Nowhere is that more clear than in champion reworks, where we have to make sure that the new and improved kits feel improved and yet still the same.

With Taric, that struggle was pretty strong, as we all remembered playing Taric in the past. When we think of Taric, the key ideas that came to mind were his simplicity, and the bucket of stats he gave his team. Once we got over the more complicated kit of Taric, we grew pretty attached to the protective nature of his kit.

We especially learned to enjoy playing around his passive. If you’re ahead, and get to stagger your abilities and make optimal use of your passive, Taric can be quite aggressive and know that he will always have an ability up to bail out a teammate -- or himself. On the other hand, If you’re behind, and don’t get to use your passive consistently, Taric has to choose his actions more carefully, and rely on high-impact reactive casts.

Moreover, thanks to the use unusual targeting (your Bastion conduit), we got to really feel growing mastery of this champion over time, hitting a clutch stun or ultimate based on the positioning of an ally. There are certainly some frustration points (sometimes your allies just don’t move the way you’d expect them to, but playing Taric teaches you to be pretty good at reading your allies’ movements, not just your enemies.

Of course, Taric did have to give some things up, including his explosive burst combo and his simplicity, but getting to explore the deep mastery curve of new Taric more than made up for it in our opinion.

What do you think of the Taric rework or sustain changes? Have any questions about what it’s like to work as a Riot playtester? Maybe some questions about 6.8 as a whole? As usual, feel free to ask any questions about balance or what exactly our job is! We will be around for the next few hours and will try to answer as many questions as possible.

Adam "Afic" Cohen Ben “Cezium” Burkhardt Shawn “I Am The IRS” Currie Miles “Daydreamin” Hoard Mattias “Gentleman Gustaf” Lehman Nicholas “Nickwu” Smith Blake “Ex Shepherd” Soberanis Trevor “ThEntropist” Thernes

Ok. This is what I have to ask the "Playtest team".

How much do you guys get paid?

warpenguin5554/19/2016, 8:11:38 PM1 votes

Which mage did you have the most fun playtesting of the big 6

Lord Caelistis4/19/2016, 10:14:49 PM1 votes

Did you test the TariKalista botlane? It looks like it got some pretty insane potential thanks to the double-bond they can create.

On another (related) subject, how does a Jhin/Taric botlane fares? It looks like Taric could set up some nice CC chains up close, while keeping a link with Jhin just in case the Protector fails to stop the menace. Their ults could also work quite nicely in tandem, given that in teamfights, it's hard to dodge point-blank Jhin bullets; adding invincibility on top of the pudding seems quite delicious for me (and somewhat less tasty for the schmucks I'm about to terminate). Do you think this botlane, which leads Jhin to a more aggressive and up-close playstyle, has potential in a real situation?