How to fix the boards "bandwagon" effect.

Metallmeister·5/11/2017, 8:23:56 PM·115 votes·6,920 views

To fully understand the argument, read thoroughly to the end. And thanks for your time.

This is going to be about the psychological "bandwagon" effect of the boards community. For instance, lets say a new post received two down votes within the first 10 minutes. Everyone else will already have a subjective attitude towards the post, either creating less traffic by not clicking on the post, or by furthering the downvotes. Even if the idea was good, the first 20 that viewed the post and two disliked, it will dictate the future of the post. Same thing happens with upvotes too, it will create a snowball effect. What this means is that a select group of people, usually the first 20-50 readers will create a bandwagon effect. For example, if a meme or gameplay post has no up votes or downvotes, the post is looked at objectively. On the other hand, a post with 4 downvotes will create this perception that "This post has downvotes, so whatever is on it must mean its bad." Although, if you take the same exact post, and put 10 likes on it with your alternate accounts, it will create the opposite perception. This is why sometimes you read a post with some downvotes on it, then read the same post from another well-respected individual that blows up with over 100 upvotes. How do I think this can be fixed? Hide the upvotes/downvotes for the first hour and replace it with a (?). What this will do is it allows everyone to dictate the post by themselves and not let a couple downvotes discourage an upvote. It also fixes how the first 20-50 readers do not dictate whether the post dies or blows up to over 5k readers. If you don't think this solution would work, tell me why.

Also posted this in Boards Feedback. It fits well in both categories but since Boards Community & Moderation is a new category, I thought it would be best to bring this topic up in it first.

99 Comments

SpecterVonBaren5/11/2017, 9:34:38 PM17 votes

I'd rather they show both down and upvotes so you can see how many people liked and disliked something. A person could have 100 upvotes and 102 downvotes but there's no way to know this and thus the information on how the post is received is hidden.

Milla Jovovich5/11/2017, 8:24:49 PM15 votes

I see your name around...

Have an upvote amigo

Won't read this essay tho

Warlord Scrap5/11/2017, 8:40:05 PM9 votes

Part of the problem is people think up votes/downvotes mean i agree/disagree when in reality upvotes/downvotes are for on topic/off topic.

And people do whine way too many whine random champ is op while having no suggested fixes.

Fisher No Chains5/11/2017, 11:55:07 PM6 votes

On the EU boards (https://boards.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/ , yes EU has boards too!) you can't upvote/downvote or see the upvotes until you read a thread.

Same stuff could be done on NA boards.

notice me Sin pi5/12/2017, 1:02:17 AM4 votes

i'd rather prefer to see the [number of upvotes] + [number of downvotes] than just [?].

Mordepool5/12/2017, 2:33:44 AM4 votes

Excellent idea for fostering actual discussion

ModWuks5/11/2017, 10:16:48 PM4 votes

All 319 words read in entirety ✅

Honestly, I think this would a great feature. There's not much I can contribute to this discussion since it'd be on the development team to pick up, but I would support this idea 100% if the resources open up.

Chromatic Eagle5/11/2017, 10:26:50 PM3 votes

Paragraphs son.

Velzard of Koz5/11/2017, 11:00:42 PM2 votes

Luckily this doesn't happen always. Already saw few topics (and couple of mine comments) being initially downvoted but then more traffic happened around specific hours and the post that was -3 a while ago is suddenly +15.

Anyway, I had an idea of simply separating downvotes from upvotes. Upvotes would start with 1 and would be seen and you could either ignore or upvote, giving the post more credit. In case you found the post bad, either because it was offensive, non-contributing or contra-productive, you could give it downvote where you would just see whether you downvoted or not but wouldn't see how much downvotes the post already has. The downvotes would be hidden and only work in the background for tresholds. For example, at 10 DV it would be displayed in list of topics/comments with less priority, at 40 DV it would get hidden etc.

I don't think the time-based hiding would work perfectly as most of local readers are NA and so you would only get the right result at specific hours when most people are likely to be here and judge the topic before the votes are shown. This hurts (or leaves with no effect) those in different timeline or people who like to post in non-traditional times.

BUT NA is still majority that should dictate and it would work, not perfectly, but would work, so in case no better solution would be found, I support this.

JaxMoonStealer5/12/2017, 2:46:51 AM2 votes

Reddit does this and it works pretty well. I agree with you.

TacoKingIII5/12/2017, 7:28:37 AM1 votes

A lot of people like me want to see how many people like/dislike the post, and most of the time we won't be bothered to come back later unless it's a really interesting discussion.

I think the solution is people learning to think for themselves. That probably won't happen but upvotes/downvotes don't matter too much anyway.

I also liked the idea someone else posted about showing both upvotes and downvotes.

deltemp9515125/12/2017, 5:44:40 PM1 votes

Or they could get rid of the upvotes and downvotes and do away with the board toxicity.

[slayer-jinx-catface]

Teridax686/8/2017, 4:06:03 PM1 votes

I can agree with this, a trial period for any new thread could go a long way towards preventing it from being dead on arrival just because of an initial downvote. However, I don't think that will fully address the larger bandwagon effect, which is that some topics are just more popular than others. If a thread goes on in Gameplay that makes a witty joke bashing Lee Sin/Yasuo/whichever champion is unpopular at the moment, even if its upvotes are hidden it's still very likely to get dozens of upvotes within the first few hours, and shoot to the front page after that. Similarly, a thread making a well-reasoned argument about a point people disagree with (let's say someone wants Sion to be reworked, for example) might still get buried simply because people in general will want to shoot it down, even if they don't see its score. This could help alleviate issues with the Boards' upvote system, but this might be more of a band-aid than a full solution in itself.