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Caitlyn doesn't fulfill the Sniper power fantasy

The5lacker··64 votes·9,267 views

Right now, Caitlyn has problems. She's a hyper-safe, poorly scaling carry who's an insurmountable lane bully and harder to catch than Jinx herself (Which makes absolutely no sense when you stop and think about it.) Between her range, traps, and recoil-dash, Cait simply isn't engaging to lane against.

But that's not her real problem. Cait's real problem is that she's a terrible sniper. Where's the carefully studying opponents? Where's the incredible short range vulnerability? Where's the lining up the perfect shot (Ace in the Hole sorta fulfills that, but it's pretty underwhelming) to take out a priority target?

Long story short, Caitlyn needs both vulnerabilities and abilities that actually fulfill the sniper fantasy, as opposed to abilities that fulfill the "Incredibly safe and aggravating carry" fantasy. She's not a huge priority, but I still think she needs a small-scale rework to get her in line with both Riot's design philosophies of interesting choices and her actual core concept in ways other than "Hurr durr she's got range."

  • Passive - Keen Eyes

  • Caitlyn studies visible opponents, discerning their weaknesses. Visible enemy champions within a radius around her are studied over 10/9/8/7/6/5 seconds (At levels 1/4/7/10/13/16), after which they are Marked. Against Marked enemies, Caitlyn gains 20% Armor Penetration and her attacks deal bonus physical damage equal to 20% of her total Attack Damage. This bonus damage is multiplied on Critical Strikes. Enemies aren't aware they're being watched unless they're within Caitlyn's vision radius.

  • Enemies that Caitlyn loses vision of become unMarked after 3 seconds. In addition, whenever Caitlyn takes damage from an enemy champion, her concentration is disrupted, temporarily unMarking and delaying Marking enemies for 3 seconds.

  • Marking Radius: 1100 (+50 per level)

  • Q - Piltover Peacemaker

  • Active - Caitlyn chambers a special round into her rifle, disabling her ability to attack or use abilities for one second but retaining her ability to move. For 5 seconds afterwards, Caitlyn's next attack fires an incredibly fast piercing round that deals 20/35/50/65/80 (+120/125/130/135/140% total AD) physical damage to enemies it passes through, reduced by 10% for each enemy it hits to a minimum of 50% damage. Caitlyn retains her normal attack range for the attack, but the shell travels to a maximum range of 1200. This attack can be triggered against structures, but doesn't deal bonus damage to them. On-hit effects and critical hits are only applied to the primary target of the attack, and critical hits don't count any of the bonus damage.

  • While Piltover Peacemaker is primed, Caitlyn can reactivate it to fire it as a skillshot. This shot doesn't apply on-hit effects or crits to any enemy hit, but otherwise behaves as normal.

  • Cost: 60/65/70/75/80 Mana

  • Cooldown: 10/9/8/7/6 Seconds (Notes: Piltover Peacemaker loses a lot of its oppressive early and mid game damage but becomes a bit easier to hit at medium range. Also keep in mind that while the 20% AD on-hit effect from Keen Eyes is only applied to the primary target, but the 20% Armor Penetration applies against all targets hit.)

  • W - Yordle Snap Trap

  • Passive - Caitlyn generates and stores a trap every 20/18/16/14/12 seconds. This stock time is effected by cooldown reduction. Caitlyn can store up to 2 traps at a time.

  • Active - Caitlyn sets a trap at a location that arms after a short delay. An enemy champion that steps on a trap is dealt 80/120/160/200/240 (+50% AP) magic damage and is snared for 1.5 seconds. Caitlyn also gains True Sight of the enemy for 8 seconds, and enemies are immediately Marked.

  • Traps last for up to 4 minutes, and Caitlyn can have up to 3 traps out at a time. Placing an extra trap deactivates the oldest one. Traps can be targeted and destroyed with 3 autoattacks similarly to wards.

  • Cost: 50 Mana + 1 Trap

  • Static Cooldown: 2 second

  • Range: 600 (Notes: YST loses range and damage but gains the ability to store a pair for quick deployment, allowing Caitlyn to quickly set up a small sniper nest. It also allows her to quickly Mark priority targets, though the traps still have a short arm time.)

  • E - Kinetic Barrier

  • Active - Caitlyn activates her shield belt, sending out a pulse of energy that knocks enemies back, dealing 60/100/140/180/220 (+50% AP) magic damage to enemies around her and slowing them by 30/35/40/45/50% for 2 seconds, with the slow decaying over its duration. Caitlyn also gains a shield that absorbs up to 60/100/140/180/220 (+50% AP) damage and lasts for up to 3 seconds.

  • Cost: 80 Mana

  • Cooldown: 18/17/16/15/14 Seconds

  • Range: 325 (Notes: Caitlyn trades the hyper-safe net jump for a medium-low strength shield/AoE slow. Still very safe, but doesn't allow her to reposition herself, harass enemies from a distance, etc. On the upside it still grants Caitlyn a line of defense against assassins, which maintains her safe nature without making it completely excessive like it used to be.)

  • Ultimate - Ace in the Hole

  • Active - Caitlyn targets an enemy at extreme range, channeling for 1.5 seconds. If the enemy is Marked, she channels for 0.5 seconds instead. At the end of the channel, Caitlyn fires a special homing round that travels at incredible speeds, dealing 100/175/250 (+150% total AD) to the first enemy champion in its path. If Ace in the Hole hits its targeted champion deals 1.25% increased damage for each 1% of the enemy's health that's missing, up to a maximum of 200/350/500 (+300% total AD) damage to enemies at or below 20% health. If the targeted champion is Marked, Ace it the hole deals maximum damage to enemies at or below 40% health instead. If Caitlyn loses vision of the target, the target becomes untargetable, or she cancels the ability by reactivating it, Ace in the Hole goes on a reduced 10 second cooldown but doesn't refund its mana cost.

  • Cost: 100 Mana

  • Cooldown: 120/105/90 Seconds

  • Range: 2000/2500/3000 (Notes: Ace in the Hole gets quite a few degrees more mechanical complexity focused around keeping it from being a "remove a champion from the fight" button. The longer channel time is counteracted by a drastically higher projectile speed (nearly instantaneous) and a reduced channel time for targeting enemies that have either been studied or have unfortunately stepped on a trap. In addition, the penalty for intercepting a shot is drastically reduced, and the ability is much more execution focused: Against low health targets, death is all but assured if the shot connects. In addition, the total AD scaling helps smooth out its power curve. It also gains more counterplay by forcing Caitlyn players to really consider when to fire. It's important to remember that while cancelling the ability puts it on a reduced cooldown, interrupting the channel with hard CC does not, and with the longer channel time using it at close range presents a huge opening.)

CHANGELIST:

  • Cooldown on W changed to a static 2 seconds to help prevent chain CCing. (7/15/2014)
  • Marking range on passive changed to adjust with level, 1100 (+50 per Level), 2000 at level 18. (7/15/2014)
  • Removed double-speed Marking on targets that can't see Cait. (7/15/2014)
  • Keen Eyes scaling reworked: Same at levels 1 and 16. (7/17/2014)
  • Taking damage only disrupts Cait for 3 seconds, temporarily disabling Marks. (7/17/2014)

148 Comments

RiotRiot Baconhawk44 votes

I'd really like to play against this Caitlyn just to see how it feels. This kit is very dynamic and definitely moves her further out on the spectrum of ADCs to the most extreme (where she should be IMO).

Viro Melchior5 votes

I'd really like to play against this Caitlyn just to see how it feels. This kit is very dynamic and definitely moves her further out on the spectrum of ADCs to the most extreme (where she should be IMO).

I disagree with her traps being killable. While they're frustrating to play against, I think they're in a good spot. They cement here as a "zone control" style of champion. 3-hit traps that can be seen at all times just, with a 20s cooldown to place will feel incredibly impotent as a CaitlynMk2 player. It changes them from being something you can use to zone out areas to something that is only useful when placed behind yourself, where you can prevent them from being destroyed, and thus, are only useful when you retreat.

Jacze2 votes

I assumed this meant they would be invisible, like wards, and you'd have to use a sweeping lens to find them... though on reflection that does sound OP.

However, they're still pretty useful if they can be targetted. If you lay down 3 traps in the bot lane bushes, and two get destroyed while the enemy adc/support aren't near them, that's a good cue to leave.

Viro Melchior1 votes

They're only OP zoning if you don't know how to play against them, or if you're pushed under your tower. If you can push out, just step on them. They do no damage level 4-9, because Cait doesn't rank them up. Even level 2-3 they aren't that deadly.

Also, they cost a lot of mana. As someone who played a lot of Cait a while back, I can tell you that if the enemy Cait is spamming traps, she has to build mana regen, or go back to shop frequently. Its almost as bad as spamming her Q every time its up.

Heaven forbid you have a Morgana (black shield > traps) or Leona (armor buff, step on trap) who can trivialize them in lane with you.

Honestly, a better solution is to change the cc effect, not change the trap itself. For example, dropping the duration by .1 or .2 seconds. Or upping the duration, but changing it to a slow. Etc.

The5lacker3 votes

That's kinda the problem: Caitlyn already has very high range and safety, she doesn't need ludicrously oppressive zoning as well. Traps should be used to, well, trap people. Drop one in the enemy bush. They try and get away from you and lose Watched stacks, they step on the trap and you can shoot them.

OmbreNombre1 votes

I got a feeling your Caitlyn idea will be a reality, and I also feel that she'll be nerfed, I mean the Q's AD range is super high (Max Lvl. Q = 80 + 140% of total AD). And I think her W should be changed to a stun instead of a snare.

The5lacker1 votes

Current Q is 180 + 130% total AD. For her new Q to exceed the damage offered by her old Q, she'd need 1001 AD. Which...isn't possible on anyone but Sion with an Atma's and several months on-hand.

Traps don't need hard CC. Cait passively outranges just about everyone in the game already, so retaliation isn't an issue.

Add Me After2 votes

Same, I feel this was very well thought out by someone who feels strongly about the image Caitlyn shows , and how equal it was with the give and takes! I am all for this!

RiotIronStylus9 votes

How do you feel about the "sheriff fantasy"?

...I'm actually very interested in that.

I would submit, and this is my own opinion, that Caitlyn isn't a great example of a sniper fantasy, but she is potentially a fertile ground for the crack-shot sheriff.

Lord Graves III1 votes

I'd be happy with that. It sorta hurts in the sense that Sniper Rifles are weapons heavily connected to that particular fantasy but folks like me (who love sniping in every shooter ever) will get over it.

We still have Varus. Varus Even if he doesn't have the sweet rifle. ;)

RiotIronStylus7 votes

I'd be happy with that. It sorta hurts in the sense that Sniper Rifles are weapons heavily connected to that particular fantasy but folks like me (who love sniping in every shooter ever) will get over it.

We still have Varus. Varus Even if he doesn't have the sweet rifle. ;)

Yeah, honestly, if someone were to tell me that "hey, we have a sniper champion, here's a kit" I'd imagine it would be full of skill shots, literally. I honestly think Lux, Varus and Ez have more of a sniper feel to them than Caitlyn.

Messaiga3 votes

cough Xerath cough If anybody even feels like a sniper in this game, it's him. Kit full of skillshots, most of his abilities have higher than average range, and his Ultimate's range is insane (though, firing into the darkness doesn't always achieve great results).

The5lacker5 votes

I'm curious as to what the "Sheriff Fantasy" even is. Sheriffs aren't known for incredibly long range rifles, so there goes Cait's attack range, Piltover Peacemaker, and Ace in the Hole. She'd have to be reworked from the ground up to go Pistols, have abilities like Trick Shot, things like that...I dunno. The Sheriff Fantasy isn't nearly as readily defined as the Sniper Fantasy.

Speaking of which, Sniper Fantasy isn't just "Long Range Skillshots" as I mentioned before. There's waaaaay more to it than that. Patiently observing a priority target, setting up for a quick takedown, avoiding retaliation. All crucial parts of the sniper archetype. Varus fulfills most of this niche similarly to Caitlyn, but he's not so adept at the "preventing retaliation" part.

Also, even with her Live kit, I really think Cait could use the Assassin tag as a secondary. It's more or less accurate.

i am very high2 votes

I would like to point out here that her lore as "duo crime-fighting team, sheriff Caitlyn and her unruly subordinate Vi" jars heavily with her in-game use. Caitlyn at max potential is a hide in the bush, zone people out, shoot someone from good range and get away when people get close champion. That doesn't convey wild west, Mexican standoff, dual wielding six-shooters Sheriff that I think of. Her kit tells me "use me as a super long range loner who just wants to be hidden," but her lore says "run in and shoot people, man." I like this Caitlyn much more than the current Caitlyn, and I think this and maybe a couple stat tweaks would give her some seriously meaningful counter play, something she lacks a lot of right now, and a more fun and dynamic experience for Caitlyn players.

The5lacker1 votes

The thing is, that's an entirely, 100% different character from what we've got in-game. Remember, lore exists to serve and enrich the gameplay, not the other way around.

Also, where does her lore say "Run in and shoot people, man." Cait's always been described as the polar opposite of Vi. She plans, she picks her fights carefully, she keeps to the back line and picks off priority targets, organizing things in the large scheme. Vi is a very immediate thinker, charging in and taking out targets as they come. That's the big reason she needs to stay a sniper: As much as people try to deny it, that's a very core part of her identity. The people who claim otherwise are delusional and there are a number of dual pistol wielding badasses to get their "Wild West Sheriff" fix. Miss Fortune and Lucian come to mind as filling that particular niche, as well as Graves to a degree.

Khodexus1 votes

Also, I don't know where people get this pistol wielding sheriff idea to begin with. The gunslinging pistol duelists were mostly outlaws. Many of the most famous wild west 'sheriffs' were in fact rifle marksmen. Just look at Wyatt Earp, arguably the most famous 'lawman' in Western lore (note that there are known and likely unknown inconsistencies in his 'legend' versus the real life Earp for the the sake of this argument we'll use the 'legend' status). He was a great marksman, and was also known for never being shot once in all the gunfights he took part in. But he wasn't nearly the 'gunslinger' that Doc Holiday was, in fact he knew he wasn't a match for Ringo in a duel, despite his formidable skills as a marksman.

And yes, as has been said, nowhere in her lore is she equated to a 'wild west' sheriff, but she's more of a sherlock holmes investigator type who also is a crack shot sniper.

That's her lore.

But even comparing her to wild west lawmen, the rifle still fits.

BlueCannonMinion3 votes

Tbh the sniper alone makes Caitlyn not fulfill the Sheriff fantasy for me. my image of a sheriff is either a Magnum long-barrel( still a handgun not a rifle at all) or B a shotgun. hell, Graves fulfills one my ideal sheriffs kit ant all, and hes an outlaw

if my mental sheriff were to have a rifle it would be a 22. but it would have standard sights and certainly not a scope. and the removal of the scope would remove the sniper fantasty aspect of cait.

the kit OP laid out does seem really well thought out. and rather interesting aswell. and would indeed fulfill the sniper fanstasy given the proper style

Zaccea1 votes

How do you feel about the "sheriff fantasy"?

...I'm actually very interested in that.

Ehh.. a sheriff doesn't wear mini-skirts though.. I always hated her outfit and always thought her "Sheriff Caitlyn" skin should have been her default clothing! Is she a stripper or an officer? Because she looks more like the former than the latter. And yes, I've seen the new art. It still doesn't satisfy the sheriff look, but at least she looks less like a stripper.

The5lacker1 votes

Everyone seems to have this very set and very bland idea of what a "Sheriff" must be. She's the sheriff of Piltover. You know, the mythical, high-tech city of our fantasy setting. She's not gonna like like some wild wild west, six-shooter wielding gunslinger who chews tobacco and wears plaid. That's boring and it does her a massive disservice.

Not saying her current outfit is exactly reasonable, but it is memorable, and I'll take that over "historically accurate" in my fantasy games every day of the week.

Khodexus1 votes

I like the new splash art, but I wish it wasn't basically an 'upskirt' shot. Probably a little late to complain now.

And for her eventual VU, I hope they keep the gun as it is in the new splashart, and I hope they keep the top hat. Beyond that, I'd love to see her in slacks and a long coat, instead of a skirt.

Mirage Night1 votes

As much as she is the "sheriff" lore wise, her overall behavior in gameplay is effectively a long range "sharp shooter". Between her passive being "ambushy" with how it interacts with brush, her longer range, and her ultimate. Game play is a sniper. As such for those who picked up the character on a mechanical basis first, she her as a sniper.

The OP is probably one of those, as am I. As a result, he wants to enhance this gameplay fantasy all the while giving her engaging kit the fulfill this fantasy.

Insanity 1018 votes

Yes pls

Khodexus6 votes

Okay, I used to Caitlyn main, and she's still my favorite overall champion. Only reason I don't main her anymore is cause I got tired of the difficulty finding a good support, and gravitated more towards mid-lane mages.

That said, I think your overall kit here is pretty decent. The thing I like most about your E is that it really makes her fit better in Piltover with all the other crazy inventions and techmaturgy stuff. I'd like to see this carried to her W a bit too. Not mechanically, but visually. Imagine a 'snap trap' that instead of just a bear trap, had a little spinning laser sensor on it, and then exploded with some kind of glowing 'tracer' goo when someone set it off. That would explain the true vision, as well as the snare effect.

The passive needs a little work, however. The thing that concerns me right now is how easy it would be for other ADCs to just tag her every couple seconds to completely negate her passive. Whatever you might say, the fact of the matter is most champions she'll be fighting against will have ways of safely poking just enough, whether it's Vayne rolling in, and then dodging back out before you or your support can react, or someone with a long-range skillshot. What I'd like to see here, is rather than taking damage causing you to lose all stacks, is rather it just 'disrupts' your stack growth rate. When you take damage it pauses all stacks, and only if you take several hits do the stacks actually start to deplete. And yes, I said deplete, not disappear.

That said, I think I'd like to switch two aspects of her Q and Ult. I'd like to see Q just grant her a sizable boost to her auto-attack range for one shot, and add the piercing line effect to Ace in the Hole, giving her the bonus damage ONLY if the 'first champion hit' is the one she's targeting. While I like Peacemaker as is, I think the piercing effect is just more fitting for her ultimate, and I'd love for her to be able to throw out a really long range auto-attack once in a while, at the cost of her cooldown and mana, that is.

Let me know what you think of these suggestions.

The5lacker3 votes

Eh, I like her current traps. Can't really change them too much, otherwise she loses the adorable pet name Vi gave her. XD

Poking and safely poking are two different things. Again, especially with Cait's superior range and retaliation potential, and, you know, a support. Anyone forgoing CS (and spending mana) to harass her is likely to wind up with a deficit in the "coming out on top" department, especially with the minor tweak I made with her shield (Shield damage doesn't disrupt her passive, so if the shield holds Cait gets to keep being terrifying.) Having it simply delay the effect would make Cait waaaay too oppressive, I feel, and would more or less negate the need to harass her, granting her free reign as soon as she triggers it. This way, Cait and whoever she's laning against have a very definite back and forth, as Cait tries to maximize her own harassment potential without taking any in return and her laning opponent tries not to get shot with particularly scary bullets too many times.

Making her Q a boring, high range single shot ability just feels, well, boring. More importantly, it'd completely gut Cait's wave clear as she already has an exceptionally poor attack speed compared to other ACDs and her primary kit steroid (Keen Eyes) ignores minions. Plus, people already whine about Cait being able to out-range towers, and with that change she theoretically could. Which would be bad. One thing I am thinking about changing is allowing her to re-cast it during its duration to fire it like a skillshot, having it not apply on-hit effects to anything in exchange for being able to hit targets outside of her range without requiring tricky aiming. As for making Ace in the Hole piercing...I tried. I really didn't like it. Even with the reduced damage it's going to more or less be a completely guaranteed kill on a lot of champions, which I...don't like her getting. I feel that'd be way too safe for an ability that already might as well read "Ruin somebody's day."

Khodexus1 votes

I didn't say anything about removing the cupcake, just changing the 'bear trap' into something a little more techmaturgical.

I still stand by my Q/R suggestions, though I do recognize that it would negatively effect her wave clear, but I suppose the question we need to ask is, 'is that a bad thing'? Also, I was thinking the cooldown on the new Q should be something like the equivalent of 8 auto-attacks, and should scale with attack speed, instead of cooldown reduction.

I almost considered having it actually charge up with auto-attacks, like her current passive, but just taking the time of a certain number of autos I think is better.

I don't think a high range single shot is any more 'boring' than a piercing wing-shaped projectile. And the ability to out-range towers is offset by the cooldown/mana cost, and you'd still have to stick with/behind your minions or the enemies would jump on you anyways.

And when I said safely poking, I meant 'safely' poking. As I mentioned I play Cait quite a bit, and there are any number of other champions who can safely get into range to get off a little bit of damage without Cait or her support having time to retaliate. Caitlyn already has one of the slowest move speeds in the game, and with a very slow attack speed on top of that, for a marksman, it can be tricky for her to use her 'superior range' to any significant advantage in trades with other ADCs, unless the range gap is truly significant.

Ezreal, Vayne, Jinx, Quinn, Ashe, Tristana, and Varus can consistently out-poke Caitlyn due to very small range gap, easy to spam long range abilities, superior mobility, or some combination of the above. And supports like Lulu, Lux, Thresh, Blitzcrank, and Morgana can similarly out-poke Caitlyn, or at least Zone her so she hasno safe poking herself.

At the very most, taking damage should deplete your stacks incrementally, rather than removing them outright. Especially given the time it takes to get any use out of them.

The5lacker2 votes

We do not need to give the carry with the longest base range in the game Yasuo's Q. And we also don't need to give a sniper an ability that scales on AS (Just...wat?)

You do realize that, even with its long range, high mana cost, and limited availability, they have to remove Twitch's ult's ability to hit towers, right? Attacking towers from outside of their range is something Riot will never allow. Ever. Under any circumstances.

Ezreal, Quinn, and Jinx all need a clear line of sight, Vayne needs to get close and risks retaliation, Jinx and Tristana only out-range Cait far later than the laning phase, and Varus plays similarly to Cait but, you know, doesn't even get that kind of passive (Varus's passive makes me sad.) Any attempt at aggression against Cait can and should be met with counter-aggression by any competent player. Nobody is going to be constantly harassing anyways as, interestingly enough, farming is of a slightly higher priority for most players. Cait has superior harassment range early game and her passive is up incredibly quickly late game. There is no problem.

Thales4 votes

What I'd do to enhance the sniper fantasy is give her a passive that gives her a moderate amount of bonus range if she doesn't attack for a few seconds. Sort of like Ashe's passive, I guess.

The5lacker3 votes

Eh, that's too safe and doesn't really fulfill the sniper fantasy as well as studying a specific opponent for a period of time before terminating them with extreme prejudice.

Plus, then we'd have an ADC passive that's worse than Ashe's, and that's just cruel.

Thales2 votes

Range is the best stat in the game. It would not be a weak passive, because Cait getting to poke you from, say 750 range is absurd in lane. Studying a specific target isn't really implementable in a passive, which are inherently untargeted. This captures the notion of taking the time to line up a perfect shot. The shot could probably also have some armor penetration on it without being problematic.

The5lacker1 votes

Range is great for sustained engagements as you can keep dealing damage without retaliation. Having 800 range for a single attack is nice but useless late game as ADCs have attack speeds upwards of 2.0. If it takes 5 seconds for the passive to reset, that's a 90% reduction in damage just to keep enemies out of range...which Cait already does.

Thales2 votes

True, this would be a lot weaker in lategame teamfights. But is a pitched brawl firing extremely quickly even where a sniper thematically ought to shine? It's not as useless late as you think, because it's still very good for sieging. Even if she's only at 800 range for one autoattack, that still lets her get in a shot on a tower or defender that no one else would be able to.

IlyaK19861 votes

Yes, that's the BEST time for a sniper to shine. The idea is that if nobody is targeting the sniper, the sniper can drop people one at a time in one shot. This remake has all the vulnerabilities but none of the strengths.

Thales2 votes

I'm talking about in a fight, where the sniper is dodging incoming skillshots and firing two times per second. I definitely think having that be a lousy situation for Cait relative to other ADCs is fine.

i am very high1 votes

I think there would be a problem with implementing that passive in lane. Not attacking minions will inhibit wave clear, and Cait's wave clear is already super shitty. Also, how often do you think about proccing Ashe's passive? You die, so you run back to lane and get one free crit. Cool? That's a pretty bad passive, if you think about it, and so I feel like implementing anything with "sort of like Ashe's passive" in mind would be a waste of time.

Thales1 votes

Cait's waveclear is already in the upper half of ADCs. Ashe's passive isn't as bad as you suppose, but this isn't equivalent to it. Ashe's passive takes a long time to charge up (much, much more than the ~5 seconds this would be), and even with Ashe's solid range, can be hard to expend on the enemy laner. This gets you to such range that the enemy may have no choice but to eat the autoattack.

Sure, not autoattacking for 5 seconds is a cost even in lane. So? Range is the best stat.

Dreyst2 votes

I quite like this idea, as it basically fixes the misplaced passive on this new kit. I feel like the idea of "watching" would be more suited to an assassin Champion that has its theme set in the jungle, like a more squishy Rengar.

MrBuffington4 votes

Well I don't know how this will play so I'm not so sure about passing judgment on it yet. The proposed passive does sound interesting, if a little complex, but definitely seems better (thematically, again not sure about balance yet) than her current passive (why would a dedicated sniper only be able to hit a headshot 1 in 7/5/3 times?).

I'm a little off-put at her new Q, it's basically just Lucian's with some travel time and extra range, no? I'm also curious why you got rid of both of Caitlyn's skillshots.

I'm also wondering what you think about some ability that scales with range, sort of like Nidalee Q? What if this was integrated into her passive? So her Autos would get a bonus at max range, and also she'd be weaker at melee range, encouraging people to close distance with her?

Overall some interesting ideas, I like the execute addition to the ult (makes more sense for a sniper)

Kloroform3 votes

This is a really amazing suggestion, I've always thought it odd that she could raise her rifle and "snipe" twice a second. Just didn't seem in line with her weapon of choice or model-suggested fighting style. This brings that out really well while maintaining her current niche as a strong, long ranged ADC. The ult change is immensely welcome as well.

TheFakeMackie3 votes

So this is really cool. I love the new passive because it really rewards players for setting up the zones that they want to fight in via vision control so that they can let the passive build up. I.e. ward placement around dragon and vision denial before fights. That rewards the smart caitlyn players in a much cooler way than; ok we have vision of them so we can sneak up on them. With that change you really feel like a sniper waiting as long as possible to take the shot on an opponent before you lose vision of them or before they find you. The way I could see the new peacemaker working is kind of like lucians q which would make it more consistent, but the damage changes make the scaling less oppressive early and better late game. I also like the new e because it would be way more fun and interactive to play against. Finally though, having her ult be a longer channel execute is way more fulfilling than her current; nuke a squishy before the teamfight with zero risk.

MonsieurBanana3 votes

I think that you need to rethink the shield; to me, it seems like a shield is completely out of place with a sniper.

The5lacker3 votes

It's an emergency defensive tool: Someone gets too close, pop the shield. Someone else is shooting at you, pop the shield. Are you telling me a sniper wouldn't prepare some sort of backup tool to ensure their own survival? Especially one from Piltover hunting a dangerous, well armed criminal with a fondness for explosives.

Dreyst1 votes

Isn't the whole idea of a sniper "don't be seen/targeted" to begin with? I would rather the E be something regarding movement, ie. the current 90 Caliber Net to dodge skillshots rather than mitigate damage through shielding.

The5lacker1 votes

I seem to recall specifically stating that as a champion with long range, high damage, and decent CC, Cait should not have mobility. Especially the ability to wall jump.

Dreyst1 votes

Her CC is extremely unreliable, even more so than that of Jinx's chompers because of their priming time, and because they are easily avoided.

The5lacker1 votes

An ADC with two forms of CC, one in trap form that lasts up to 4 minutes and can be hidden in bushes and one that's a high speed skillshot attached to a dash, is "unreliable." ... In addition to that being complete lunacy, Jinx's traps have an equal or greater arm time, longer cooldown, and a 5 second duration compared to Cait's 4 minute trap timer.

5G8Nri0B542 votes

I actually full agree with the TC. But...I feel sorry for him once all the people who are a) afraid you're trying to get her buffed and b) people who main her who doesn't want ANY changes in the game catches wind of you.

The5lacker3 votes

TC?

5G8Nri0B543 votes

Thread Creator...you...The5Lacker...

The5lacker2 votes

Gotcha. I'm more used to the Original Poster term.

5G8Nri0B542 votes

Yeah, well, Original Poster (OP) gets confusing when it also stands for overpowered.

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